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Challenges

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Re: Challenges

Postby AforAmpere » October 3rd, 2018, 9:17 pm

wwei23 wrote:Find one of those that uses a replicator not based on this one.

Do we have to use 2-sate isotropic, or can we do a non-symmetric rule with this behavior?
Things to work on:
- Find a (7,1)c/8 ship in a Non-totalistic rule (someone please search the rules)
- Find a C/10 in JustFriends
- Find a C/10 in Day and Night
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Re: Challenges

Postby PHPBB12345 » October 3rd, 2018, 9:19 pm

AforAmpere wrote:
wwei23 wrote:Find one of those that uses a replicator not based on this one.

Do we have to use 2-sate isotropic, or can we do a non-symmetric rule with this behavior?

Hint: It's use 2-state isotropic rule.
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Re: Challenges

Postby wwei23 » October 3rd, 2018, 9:20 pm

AforAmpere wrote:
wwei23 wrote:Find one of those that uses a replicator not based on this one.

Do we have to use 2-sate isotropic, or can we do a non-symmetric rule with this behavior?

2-state isotropic. After all, if one exists, there's probably another, like the huge variety of Sierpinski builders. Surely there must be a variety of these.
Also, I don't know if any exist in totalistic rules, the answer is probably no...
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Re: Challenges

Postby 77topaz » October 4th, 2018, 1:41 am

A non-isotropic example was known at least since May this year: viewtopic.php?p=60361#p60361
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Re: Challenges

Postby dvgrn » October 23rd, 2018, 3:28 pm

New small challenge:

I'm in need of a one-time attachment to a Scorbie Splitter that gets an extra glider out, but only the first time the circuit is used.

I can manage this with the three white still lifes below, which are fairly cheap for slsparse to construct. Can anyone find just one or two Spartan-ish still lifes that can accomplish the same trick?

Code: Select all
x = 143, y = 86, rule = LifeHistory
54.4B50.B$55.4B48.2B$56.4B46.3B$57.4B44.4B$58.4B42.4B$59.4B40.4B$60.
4B38.4B$61.4B36.4B$62.4B34.4B$63.4B32.4B$64.4B30.4B$65.4B28.4B$36.2A
11.A16.4B4.B21.4B$35.B2AB9.A.A16.4B2.3B19.4B$36.3B9.A.A17.9B5.2A10.4B
$35.B.B9.2A.3A2.2A12.9B4.A10.4B$35.5B8.B4.A2.A13.8B.BA.A9.4B$35.6B6.
2AB3A3.A.AB2.4B3.9B.B2A9.4B$35.8B4.2A.A6.2AB2.5B2.11B10.4B$36.13B10.
8B2.11B9.4B$34.13B12.21B8.4B$33.15B12.19B8.4B$33.15B10.B2.19B6.4B$32.
17B.B5.26B3.4B$32.51B.4B$31.13B2A13B2A21B.4B$30.14B2A13B2A25B$29.2AB
3.50B$28.A2.A4.48B$27.A.2A5.6B3.B2.2B2.33B$27.A7.6B13.4B2.7B2.16B$26.
2A6.9B17.6B3.18B$33.4B4.2A19.3B5.18B$32.4B5.A21.B4.3B.9B3.B2CB$31.4B
7.3A23.2A3.8B4.BC3B6.B$30.4B10.A24.A6.4B5.BCBC2B4.3B$29.4B33.3A5.4B6.
3B2C5B.3B$28.4B34.A7.2A8.18B$27.4B44.A8.19B$26.4B42.3A10.18B$25.4B43.
A10.19B$24.4B55.7B2C12B$23.4B56.7B2C6B.3B2C$22.3CB58.8B2.4B2.2B2C$22.
2BC61.6B9.4B$23.C62.5B11.4B$86.5B12.4B$87.3B14.4B$88.B16.4B$106.3B$
107.2B$108.B11$116.4B19.B$117.4B6.E10.2B$.2A115.4B5.3E7.4B$A.A116.4B
7.E5.4B$2.A117.4B5.2E4.4B$121.4B4.9B$122.4B5.6B$123.4B2.8B$124.15B$
125.14B$126.13B$127.10B.B2E$129.3B2EB3.BE.E$129.3B2EB6.E$131.4B6.2E$
131.3B$128.EB.2B$127.E.EB2EB$127.E.EBEBEB$124.2E.E.E.E.E2.E$124.E2.E
2.2E.4E$126.2E4.E$132.E.E$133.2E!
#C [[ THUMBNAIL THUMBSIZE 2 Z 4 ]]

EDIT: There would be an advantage if the output glider went southeast but didn't hit the Snark I've added in yellow in the southeast. So my solution really counts as 5sL, not 3sL, because I have to add a couple of boats or eaters or something to bounce the glider out of the way of the Snark. Southeast is the ideal direction for the glider, though, so if it goes some other direction then add 1sL to get it back on track.

Really "Spartan" is pretty much an out-of-date concept now, unless we modernize it to mean just "anything that slsparse has no problem constructing". The slsparse construction database has a large number of relatively rare still lifes and constellations that I would never have dared to try to include in old pre-slmake self-constructing circuitry.

For example, when I needed to change a glider's color in the most recent Orthogonoids, I didn't have to think twice about it, just threw in an aircraft carrier and slsparse happily compiled it for me along with everything else.
Last edited by dvgrn on October 23rd, 2018, 4:02 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: added a Snark on the Scorbie Splitter's transparent lane
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Re: Challenges

Postby BlinkerSpawn » October 23rd, 2018, 11:01 pm

4-sL-equivalent solution which can be flipped to go either way:
x = 88, y = 47, rule = LifeHistory
32.4B50.B$33.4B48.2B$34.4B46.3B$35.4B44.4B$36.4B42.4B$37.4B40.4B$38.
4B38.4B$39.4B36.4B$40.4B34.4B$41.4B32.4B$42.4B30.4B$43.4B28.4B$14.2A
11.A16.4B4.B21.4B$13.B2AB9.A.A16.4B2.3B19.4B$14.3B9.A.A17.9B5.2A10.4B
$13.B.B9.2A.3A2.2A12.9B4.A10.4B$13.5B8.B4.A2.A13.8B.BA.A9.4B$13.6B6.
2AB3A3.A.AB2.4B3.9B.B2A9.4B$13.8B4.2A.A6.2AB2.5B2.11B10.4B$14.13B10.
8B2.11B9.4B$12.13B12.21B8.4B$11.15B12.19B8.4B$11.15B10.B2.19B6.4B$10.
17B.B5.26B3.4B$10.51B.4B$9.13B2A13B2A21B.4B$8.14B2A13B2A25B$7.2AB3.
50B$6.A2.A4.48B$5.A.2A5.6B3.B2.2B2.33B$5.A7.6B13.4B2.7B2.16B$4.2A6.9B
17.6B3.16B$11.4B4.2A19.3B5.14B$10.4B5.A21.B4.3B.9B4.2C$9.4B7.3A23.2A
3.8B3.C2.C$8.4B10.A24.A6.4B4.C2.C$7.4B33.3A5.4B7.2C$6.4B34.A7.2A$5.4B
44.A$4.4B42.3A$3.4B43.A14.2C9.2C$2.4B59.C.C8.2C$.4B61.C$3CB$2BC$.C!

EDIT: Got Seeds of Destruction so I could search for a better solution but it's adding extra linebreaks to the pattern, argh!
EDIT 2: One manually-added not-Syringe later...
x = 87, y = 46, rule = LifeHistory
32.4B50.B$33.4B48.2B$34.4B46.3B$35.4B44.4B$36.4B42.4B$37.4B40.4B$38.
4B38.4B$39.4B36.4B$40.4B34.4B$41.4B32.4B$42.4B30.4B$43.4B28.4B$14.2A
11.A16.4B4.B21.4B$13.B2AB9.A.A16.4B2.3B19.4B$14.3B9.A.A17.9B5.2A10.4B
$13.B.B9.2A.3A2.2A12.9B4.A10.4B$13.5B8.B4.A2.A13.8B.BA.A9.4B$13.6B6.
2AB3A3.A.AB2.4B3.9B.B2A9.4B$13.8B4.2A.A6.2AB2.5B2.11B10.4B$14.13B10.
8B2.11B9.4B$12.13B12.21B8.4B$11.15B12.19B8.4B$11.15B10.B2.19B6.4B$10.
17B.B5.26B3.4B$10.51B.4B$9.13B2A13B2A21B.4B$8.14B2A13B2A25B$7.2AB3.
50B$6.A2.A4.48B$5.A.2A5.6B3.B2.2B2.33B$5.A7.6B13.4B2.7B2.16B$4.2A6.9B
17.6B3.16B$11.4B4.2A19.3B5.14B$10.4B5.A21.B4.3B.9B4.C$9.4B7.3A23.2A3.
8B3.C.C$8.4B10.A24.A6.4B4.C2.C$7.4B33.3A5.4B7.2C$6.4B34.A7.2A$5.4B44.
A$4.4B42.3A$3.4B43.A11.2C$2.4B55.C.C$.4B56.2C$3CB$2BC$.C!
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Re: Challenges

Postby chris_c » October 24th, 2018, 9:51 am

dvgrn wrote:I'm in need of a one-time attachment to a Scorbie Splitter that gets an extra glider out, but only the first time the circuit is used.


You don't state how useful a glider heading NW would be. Maybe because it is useless or maybe it didn't occur to you as an option (like me). Anyway, I found this:

x = 87, y = 46, rule = LifeHistory
32.4B50.B$33.4B48.2B$34.4B46.3B$35.4B44.4B$36.4B42.4B$37.4B40.4B$38.
4B38.4B$39.4B36.4B$40.4B34.4B$41.4B32.4B$42.4B30.4B$43.4B28.4B$14.2A
11.A16.4B4.B21.4B$13.B2AB9.A.A16.4B2.3B19.4B$14.3B9.A.A17.9B5.2A10.4B
$13.B.B9.2A.3A2.2A12.9B4.A10.4B$13.5B8.B4.A2.A13.8B.BA.A9.4B$13.6B6.
2AB3A3.A.AB2.4B3.9B.B2A9.4B$13.8B4.2A.A6.2AB2.5B2.11B10.4B$14.13B10.
8B2.11B9.4B$12.13B12.21B8.4B$11.15B12.19B8.4B$11.15B10.B2.19B6.4B$10.
17B.B5.26B3.4B$10.51B.4B$9.13B2A13B2A21B.4B$8.14B2A13B2A25B$7.2AB3.
50B$6.A2.A4.48B$5.A.2A5.6B3.B2.2B2.33B$5.A7.6B13.4B2.7B2.14B$4.2A6.9B
17.6B3.14B7.2A$11.4B4.2A19.3B5.13B7.A.A$10.4B5.A21.B4.3B.9B10.A$9.4B
7.3A23.2A3.8B3.2A$8.4B10.A24.A6.4B3.A2.A$7.4B33.3A5.4B6.2A$6.4B34.A7.
2A$5.4B44.A$4.4B42.3A$3.4B43.A$2.4B$.4B$3CB$2BC$.C!

as well as this:

x = 87, y = 46, rule = LifeHistory
32.4B50.B$33.4B48.2B$34.4B46.3B$35.4B44.4B$36.4B42.4B$37.4B40.4B$38.
4B38.4B$39.4B36.4B$40.4B34.4B$41.4B32.4B$42.4B30.4B$43.4B28.4B$14.2A
11.A16.4B4.B21.4B$13.B2AB9.A.A16.4B2.3B19.4B$14.3B9.A.A17.9B5.2A10.4B
$13.B.B9.2A.3A2.2A12.9B4.A10.4B$13.5B8.B4.A2.A13.8B.BA.A9.4B$13.6B6.
2AB3A3.A.AB2.4B3.9B.B2A9.4B$13.8B4.2A.A6.2AB2.5B2.11B10.4B$14.13B10.
8B2.11B9.4B$12.13B12.21B8.4B$11.15B12.19B8.4B$11.15B10.B2.19B6.4B$10.
17B.B5.26B3.4B$10.51B.4B$9.13B2A13B2A21B.4B$8.14B2A13B2A25B$7.2AB3.
50B$6.A2.A4.48B$5.A.2A5.6B3.B2.2B2.33B$5.A7.6B13.4B2.7B2.14B$4.2A6.9B
17.6B3.14B$11.4B4.2A19.3B5.13B3.A$10.4B5.A21.B4.3B.9B4.A.A$9.4B7.3A
23.2A3.8B4.A.A$8.4B10.A24.A6.4B6.A$7.4B33.3A5.4B$6.4B34.A7.2A$5.4B44.
A$4.4B42.3A$3.4B43.A$2.4B57.A$.4B57.A.A$3CB59.2A$2BC$.C!
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Re: Challenges

Postby dvgrn » October 24th, 2018, 1:57 pm

chris_c wrote:You don't state how useful a glider heading NW would be. Maybe because it is useless or maybe it didn't occur to you as an option (like me)...

Well, it will have to be turned with one or two extra still lifes, and if it's turned 180 with a long boat it fails to miss the Snark-obstacle. So I think one of the 2sL SW or NE options, plus a boat, will be the winner, unless somebody turns up a 2sL SE output that avoids the Snark. Preferably the glider would pass southwest of the Snark, while I'm wishing.

Thanks!

(This will be used for a simple first-draft memory loop spaceship. Looks like slmake might be able to compile most of it in one step, once calcyman makes a few updates, and I get a few one-time turners set up to catch that glider.)
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Re: Challenges

Postby dvgrn » October 25th, 2018, 6:52 pm

Okay, here's a trickier question: starting from a block, what's the smallest total number of slow gliders needed to produce from a block (each):

1) a splitter with one 0-degree output on the same lane as the input, and one at 90 degrees -- where the input comes from the same direction as the slow salvo;
2) two clean color-changing turners with different output parities, where the input is 90 degrees from the slow salvo;
3) two clean color-preserving one-time turners with different output parities, where the input is 90 degrees from the slow salvo

?

We have 1sL and 2sL one-time turners that do all these things, but the odds are high that other constellations will be much cheaper to construct with slow salvos. Quite possibly they'll be much larger and much uglier constellations, but if the goal is to minimize the construction cost of a freeze-dried slow salvo, that might not matter.

I guess it's probably better to add the requirement that the splitters and turners should be still-life constellations, so that there won't be any possible timing problems when it's time to trigger the seed constellation.
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