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Find a rule game

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Find a rule game

Postby Sarp » August 27th, 2018, 6:43 am

I will post a challenge every week and you'll find/create a rule to compete. The rules that perform the best will be listed at the end of every week.

Week 1 Challenge:
Find a Life-like (Totalistic 2 state) rule which the following pattern stabilises within 100000 generations and has the maximum end population (if the population oscillates then the max population counts)
x = 8, y = 7, rule = B3/S23
$2b4o$5b2o$2bob2o$2b3o$3bo!

My record is 840 cells
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby KittyTac » August 27th, 2018, 12:32 pm

Totalistic is too easy.
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby Sarp » August 27th, 2018, 1:56 pm

KittyTac wrote:Totalistic is too easy.

There are 131072 possible totalistic rules. I don't think anybody will search them all
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby AforAmpere » August 27th, 2018, 4:46 pm

I think I found the rule with 840:
x = 5, y = 5, rule = B3678/S1245678
4o$3b2o$ob2o$3o$bo!


I don't know if it can get higher through similar means.
Things to work on:
- Find a (7,1)c/8 ship in a Non-totalistic rule (someone please search the rules)
- Find a C/10 in JustFriends
- Find a C/10 in Day and Night
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby KittyTac » August 28th, 2018, 10:52 am

Sarp wrote:
KittyTac wrote:Totalistic is too easy.

There are 131072 possible totalistic rules. I don't think anybody will search them all

There are only a few totalistic rules that do not eternally explode or collapse immediately. There are about 100 interesting ones, I think.
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby Hunting » August 29th, 2018, 2:03 am

KittyTac wrote:
Sarp wrote:
KittyTac wrote:Totalistic is too easy.

There are 131072 possible totalistic rules. I don't think anybody will search them all

There are only a few totalistic rules that do not eternally explode or collapse immediately. There are about 100 interesting ones, I think.

I agree that.
Almost c/2:
x = 19, y = 10, rule = LifeHistory
7.D3.D$6.DCD.DCD$5.DC2AD2ACD$3.2DAC2.A2.CA2D$3.AC.C2.D2.C.CA$.2D.C.AD
.A.DA.C.2D$.2C.A2.A3.A2.A.2C$.CA.2D7.2D.AC$DC2.2A7.2A2.CD$2A15.2A!
#C [[ STOP 2 ]]
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby 77topaz » August 29th, 2018, 3:46 am

Somewhat off-topic (or maybe it could be considered a new challenge?): with such a figure (~100 rules), we could actually attempt to create an exhaustive list of "interesting" totalistic Life-like CA.
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby Sarp » September 2nd, 2018, 4:41 am

Week 2 challenge
Find a Three state totalistic rule that has the highest amount of space ships that fit in a 10x10 bounding box in at least 1 generation
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby Hunting » September 2nd, 2018, 5:32 am

Sarp wrote:Week 2 challenge
Find a Three state totalistic rule that has the highest amount of space ships that fit in a 10x10 bounding box in at least 1 generation

THREE state means generations?
You need to use computers to check this
Almost c/2:
x = 19, y = 10, rule = LifeHistory
7.D3.D$6.DCD.DCD$5.DC2AD2ACD$3.2DAC2.A2.CA2D$3.AC.C2.D2.C.CA$.2D.C.AD
.A.DA.C.2D$.2C.A2.A3.A2.A.2C$.CA.2D7.2D.AC$DC2.2A7.2A2.CD$2A15.2A!
#C [[ STOP 2 ]]
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby Hunting » September 2nd, 2018, 5:53 am

@Sarp, I'll try to find a solution of Week 2 challege in the "generations" rule set.
EDIT: Hopefully, I found this rule: /2/3.
Soup will usually creates a mess, but if you take a closer look on the chaotic growing mess, you'll find LOTS of spaceship travels at light-speed.
Spaceship families:
x = 28, y = 10, rule = /2/3
4.2A20.2A$4.2B19.A2B$3.A20.AB$3.B19.AB$2.A19.AB$2.B18.AB$.A18.AB$.B
17.AB$A17.AB$B17.B!

EDIT: First diag ship:
x = 4, y = 4, rule = /2/3
2.A$.BAB$A$.B!

It's c/4.
EDIT: This is sparky:
x = 10, y = 5, rule = /2/3
7.AB$6.AB.A$.AB2.AB2.B$AB.AB.AB$AB!
Almost c/2:
x = 19, y = 10, rule = LifeHistory
7.D3.D$6.DCD.DCD$5.DC2AD2ACD$3.2DAC2.A2.CA2D$3.AC.C2.D2.C.CA$.2D.C.AD
.A.DA.C.2D$.2C.A2.A3.A2.A.2C$.CA.2D7.2D.AC$DC2.2A7.2A2.CD$2A15.2A!
#C [[ STOP 2 ]]
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby KittyTac » September 2nd, 2018, 6:24 am

Hunting wrote:@Sarp, I'll try to find a solution of Week 2 challege in the "generations" rule set.
EDIT: Hopefully, I found this rule: /2/3.
Soup will usually creates a mess, but if you take a closer look on the chaotic growing mess, you'll find LOTS of spaceship travels at light-speed.
Spaceship families:
x = 28, y = 10, rule = /2/3
4.2A20.2A$4.2B19.A2B$3.A20.AB$3.B19.AB$2.A19.AB$2.B18.AB$.A18.AB$.B
17.AB$A17.AB$B17.B!

EDIT: First diag ship:
x = 4, y = 4, rule = /2/3
2.A$.BAB$A$.B!

It's c/4.
EDIT: This is sparky:
x = 10, y = 5, rule = /2/3
7.AB$6.AB.A$.AB2.AB2.B$AB.AB.AB$AB!

That's one of the best-known rules, actually. It's pretty watchable on a torus.

x = 80, y = 64, rule = /2/3
13$60.AB$59.AB$58.AB$57.AB$56.AB$55.AB$54.AB$53.AB$52.AB$51.AB$50.AB$
49.AB$48.AB$47.AB$46.AB$45.AB$44.AB$43.AB$42.AB$41.AB$40.AB$39.AB$38.
AB$37.AB$36.AB$35.AB$34.AB$33.AB$32.AB$31.AB$30.AB$29.AB.A$24.AB2.AB
2.B$23.AB.AB.AB$23.AB!
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby Hunting » September 2nd, 2018, 6:39 am

KittyTac wrote:
Hunting wrote:@Sarp, I'll try to find a solution of Week 2 challege in the "generations" rule set.
EDIT: Hopefully, I found this rule: /2/3.
Soup will usually creates a mess, but if you take a closer look on the chaotic growing mess, you'll find LOTS of spaceship travels at light-speed.
Spaceship families:
x = 28, y = 10, rule = /2/3
4.2A20.2A$4.2B19.A2B$3.A20.AB$3.B19.AB$2.A19.AB$2.B18.AB$.A18.AB$.B
17.AB$A17.AB$B17.B!

EDIT: First diag ship:
x = 4, y = 4, rule = /2/3
2.A$.BAB$A$.B!

It's c/4.
EDIT: This is sparky:
x = 10, y = 5, rule = /2/3
7.AB$6.AB.A$.AB2.AB2.B$AB.AB.AB$AB!

That's one of the best-known rules, actually. It's pretty watchable on a torus.

x = 80, y = 64, rule = /2/3
13$60.AB$59.AB$58.AB$57.AB$56.AB$55.AB$54.AB$53.AB$52.AB$51.AB$50.AB$
49.AB$48.AB$47.AB$46.AB$45.AB$44.AB$43.AB$42.AB$41.AB$40.AB$39.AB$38.
AB$37.AB$36.AB$35.AB$34.AB$33.AB$32.AB$31.AB$30.AB$29.AB.A$24.AB2.AB
2.B$23.AB.AB.AB$23.AB!

I know it's known. It's in the Golly Files. Folder: Patterns/Generations/What-a-mess.rle
Almost c/2:
x = 19, y = 10, rule = LifeHistory
7.D3.D$6.DCD.DCD$5.DC2AD2ACD$3.2DAC2.A2.CA2D$3.AC.C2.D2.C.CA$.2D.C.AD
.A.DA.C.2D$.2C.A2.A3.A2.A.2C$.CA.2D7.2D.AC$DC2.2A7.2A2.CD$2A15.2A!
#C [[ STOP 2 ]]
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby wildmyron » September 3rd, 2018, 12:51 am

@Hunting: care to provide a figure for how many spaceships exist which fit inside 10x10 bbox?

I suspect the answer is quite large - probably in the thousands even just counting p1 photons, depending on the definition of spaceship.

A different generations rule - /23/3 - might even beat Brian's Brain, at least I'm fairly sure it will based on the increase in number of p1 photons because it allows the following kinds of spaceship families in addition to those in /2/3:
x = 4, y = 49, rule = /23/3
2.BA$2.BA$.BA$.BA3$2.BA$2.BA$2.BA3$2.BA$2.BA$2.BA$.BA3$2.BA$2.BA$2.BA
$.BA$BA3$2.BA$2.BA$2.BA$.BA$.BA3$2.BA$2.BA$.BA$.BA$.BA3$2.BA$2.BA$2.B
A$2.BA3$2.BA$2.BA$2.BA$2.BA$.BA!

and maybe (depending on the definition of spaceship)
x = 5, y = 3, rule = /23/3
BA.BA$BA.BA$2.BA!


@Sarp: An interesting challenge, I'm not sure that one week is sufficient time to allow for responses though. Also, I think the rules for this challenge are a bit vague. Perhaps you could provide a few clarifications:

  1. What patterns should be considered as unique spaceships for the purpose of this challenge? For example, I think the second pattern above should count but what about patterns where the parts are less well connected, e.g.
    x = 5, y = 4, rule = /2/3
    BA$BA$3.BA$3.BA!
    where the cell at (2,2) is influenced by cells from both parts, but the actual evolution of the two parts is not distinct from the separate parts due to the rules of this particular CA.

  2. What is the definition of totalistic for this challenge? From the first challenge you evidently mean outer-totalistic and not strictly totalistic, but which multi-state rules are allowed. Some options:
    • Generations rules (outer-totalistic rules with one history state, such as /2/3).
    • totalistic or outer-totalistic rules where the total is the sum of all cell states in the neighbourhood. (Generations rules not allowed)
    • totalistic or outer-totalistic rules where the total number of cells of both states is counted and used to determine the resulting state. (Generations rules allowed, as well as many more complex rules.)
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby Hunting » September 3rd, 2018, 3:53 am

wildmyron wrote:@Hunting: care to provide a figure for how many spaceships exist which fit inside 10x10 bbox?

I suspect the answer is quite large - probably in the thousands even just counting p1 photons, depending on the definition of spaceship.

A different generations rule - /23/3 - might even beat Brian's Brain, at least I'm fairly sure it will based on the increase in number of p1 photons because it allows the following kinds of spaceship families in addition to those in /2/3:
x = 4, y = 49, rule = /23/3
2.BA$2.BA$.BA$.BA3$2.BA$2.BA$2.BA3$2.BA$2.BA$2.BA$.BA3$2.BA$2.BA$2.BA
$.BA$BA3$2.BA$2.BA$2.BA$.BA$.BA3$2.BA$2.BA$.BA$.BA$.BA3$2.BA$2.BA$2.B
A$2.BA3$2.BA$2.BA$2.BA$2.BA$.BA!

and maybe (depending on the definition of spaceship)
x = 5, y = 3, rule = /23/3
BA.BA$BA.BA$2.BA!


@Sarp: An interesting challenge, I'm not sure that one week is sufficient time to allow for responses though. Also, I think the rules for this challenge are a bit vague. Perhaps you could provide a few clarifications:

  1. What patterns should be considered as unique spaceships for the purpose of this challenge? For example, I think the second pattern above should count but what about patterns where the parts are less well connected, e.g.
    x = 5, y = 4, rule = /2/3
    BA$BA$3.BA$3.BA!
    where the cell at (2,2) is influenced by cells from both parts, but the actual evolution of the two parts is not distinct from the separate parts due to the rules of this particular CA.

  2. What is the definition of totalistic for this challenge? From the first challenge you evidently mean outer-totalistic and not strictly totalistic, but which multi-state rules are allowed. Some options:
    • Generations rules (outer-totalistic rules with one history state, such as /2/3).
    • totalistic or outer-totalistic rules where the total is the sum of all cell states in the neighbourhood. (Generations rules not allowed)
    • totalistic or outer-totalistic rules where the total number of cells of both states is counted and used to determine the resulting state. (Generations rules allowed, as well as many more complex rules.)

wildmyron, 1. History cells doesnt count.
2. I guess the third definition is right.
P. S. you'll never beat me. Just go on and you'll see.(keep the rhyme!)
Almost c/2:
x = 19, y = 10, rule = LifeHistory
7.D3.D$6.DCD.DCD$5.DC2AD2ACD$3.2DAC2.A2.CA2D$3.AC.C2.D2.C.CA$.2D.C.AD
.A.DA.C.2D$.2C.A2.A3.A2.A.2C$.CA.2D7.2D.AC$DC2.2A7.2A2.CD$2A15.2A!
#C [[ STOP 2 ]]
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby wildmyron » September 3rd, 2018, 4:55 am

Hunting wrote:wildmyron, 1. History cells doesnt count.

What do you mean? In which tally do history cells not count (according to you)?

Hunting wrote:2. I guess the third definition is right.

The traditional definition is #2 in my list, which is why I asked for clarification.

Hunting wrote:P. S. you'll never beat me. Just go on and you'll see.(keep the rhyme!)

Oh no, give me mercy.
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby Hunting » September 3rd, 2018, 5:24 am

wildmyron wrote:
Hunting wrote:wildmyron, 1. History cells doesnt count.

What do you mean? In which tally do history cells not count (according to you)?

Hunting wrote:2. I guess the third definition is right.

The traditional definition is #2 in my list, which is why I asked for clarification.

Hunting wrote:P. S. you'll never beat me. Just go on and you'll see.(keep the rhyme!)

Oh no, give me mercy.


1. History cells cannot create births, so no interactions,then the spaceship is trivial, doesnt count.
2. ?
3. ...
Almost c/2:
x = 19, y = 10, rule = LifeHistory
7.D3.D$6.DCD.DCD$5.DC2AD2ACD$3.2DAC2.A2.CA2D$3.AC.C2.D2.C.CA$.2D.C.AD
.A.DA.C.2D$.2C.A2.A3.A2.A.2C$.CA.2D7.2D.AC$DC2.2A7.2A2.CD$2A15.2A!
#C [[ STOP 2 ]]
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby Saka » September 4th, 2018, 2:01 am

This is kind of a joke, but
@RULE 3State

Yes, this is a "troll"

@TABLE
n_states:3
neighborhood:oneDimensional
symmetries:none
var a = {0,1,2}
var b={1,2}
var c={1,2}
0,b,a,b
b,0,c,0
b,0,0,0


x = 35, y = 24, rule = 3State
7.A6.A.A$5.3A7.3B$4.A2.A7.3B$16.2B10.A$15.3A10.A$26.2B3$9.4A5.B13.B$.
A2.B4.4B6.2A10.3A$2B.A5.2B.B5.4A9.2B$.4A3.B.3A8.A$2.3A5.2A8.2A$4.A$3.
2B2$8.3B.A19.3A$8.5A19.2A$8.2A.2A19.B$8.B.2A8.2B$10.2B8.B.2A$11.B9.2A
.2A$22.3B$21.B3.A!
If you're the person that uploaded to Sakagolue illegally, please PM me.
x = 17, y = 10, rule = B3/S23
b2ob2obo5b2o$11b4obo$2bob3o2bo2b3o$bo3b2o4b2o$o2bo2bob2o3b4o$bob2obo5b
o2b2o$2b2o4bobo2b3o$bo3b5ob2obobo$2bo5bob2o$4bob2o2bobobo!

(Check gen 2)
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby Hunting » September 4th, 2018, 2:11 am

Saka wrote:This is kind of a joke, but
@RULE 3State

Yes, this is a "troll"

@TABLE
n_states:3
neighborhood:oneDimensional
symmetries:none
var a = {0,1,2}
var b={1,2}
var c={1,2}
0,b,a,b
b,0,c,0
b,0,0,0


x = 35, y = 24, rule = 3State
7.A6.A.A$5.3A7.3B$4.A2.A7.3B$16.2B10.A$15.3A10.A$26.2B3$9.4A5.B13.B$.
A2.B4.4B6.2A10.3A$2B.A5.2B.B5.4A9.2B$.4A3.B.3A8.A$2.3A5.2A8.2A$4.A$3.
2B2$8.3B.A19.3A$8.5A19.2A$8.2A.2A19.B$8.B.2A8.2B$10.2B8.B.2A$11.B9.2A
.2A$22.3B$21.B3.A!

"nice" solution - almost everything is a spaceship.
BUT remember Sarp says "totalistic" - your symmetries is none, so it's non-isotropic non-totalistic.
Almost c/2:
x = 19, y = 10, rule = LifeHistory
7.D3.D$6.DCD.DCD$5.DC2AD2ACD$3.2DAC2.A2.CA2D$3.AC.C2.D2.C.CA$.2D.C.AD
.A.DA.C.2D$.2C.A2.A3.A2.A.2C$.CA.2D7.2D.AC$DC2.2A7.2A2.CD$2A15.2A!
#C [[ STOP 2 ]]
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby gameoflifemaniac » September 4th, 2018, 10:11 am

Week 3 Challenge: Find a 3-state rule with the the slowest 1-cell spaceship.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6EoRBvdVPQ
One big dirty Oro. Yeeeeeeeeee...
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby Hunting » September 4th, 2018, 10:21 am

gameoflifemaniac wrote:Week 3 Challenge: Find a 3-state rule with the the slowest 1-cell spaceship.

Difficulty level: Golly Hard.
At first, symmetric rules can not do that. So we need some rule like this:
x=1,y=1,rule=MAPAASAAA/3
o!

This is not a valid solution(or an almost solution, because the history cell doesn't matter, I think).
Almost c/2:
x = 19, y = 10, rule = LifeHistory
7.D3.D$6.DCD.DCD$5.DC2AD2ACD$3.2DAC2.A2.CA2D$3.AC.C2.D2.C.CA$.2D.C.AD
.A.DA.C.2D$.2C.A2.A3.A2.A.2C$.CA.2D7.2D.AC$DC2.2A7.2A2.CD$2A15.2A!
#C [[ STOP 2 ]]
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby gameoflifemaniac » September 4th, 2018, 10:54 am

Hunting wrote:
gameoflifemaniac wrote:Week 3 Challenge: Find a 3-state rule with the the slowest 1-cell spaceship.

Difficulty level: Golly Hard.
At first, symmetric rules can not do that. So we need some rule like this:
x=1,y=1,rule=MAPAASAAA/3
o!

This is not a valid solution(or an almost solution, because the history cell doesn't matter, I think).

I meant any of the 2^19683 3-state rules.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6EoRBvdVPQ
One big dirty Oro. Yeeeeeeeeee...
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby AforAmpere » September 4th, 2018, 4:55 pm

This thread tried to find the answer for n-states. The record for 3 states was C/36 by toroidalet.
Things to work on:
- Find a (7,1)c/8 ship in a Non-totalistic rule (someone please search the rules)
- Find a C/10 in JustFriends
- Find a C/10 in Day and Night
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby Sarp » September 10th, 2018, 1:55 am

Week 4 Challenge
Find a 2 state rule and a shape fitting in a 10x10 bounding box so that the shape stabilises in as many generations as possible (A shape stabilizes when it becomes only still lifes, oscillators, spaceships, linear growths and/or replicators that won't interact with eachother). if the shape doesn't stabilise it doesn't qualify.
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby Hunting » September 10th, 2018, 2:11 am

Sarp wrote:Week 4 Challenge
Find a 2 state rule and a shape fitting in a 10x10 bounding box so that the shape stabilises in as many generations as possible (A shape stabilizes when it becomes only still lifes, oscillators, spaceships, linear growths and/or replicators that won't interact with eachother). if the shape doesn't stabilise it doesn't qualify.

Hard! Very very very very HARD!
I'll post:
B3/S23, and this:
x = 6, y = 4, rule = B3/S23
ob3o$o4bo$obobo$bo2bo!

Hmmmm, It's 17465 gen.
Almost c/2:
x = 19, y = 10, rule = LifeHistory
7.D3.D$6.DCD.DCD$5.DC2AD2ACD$3.2DAC2.A2.CA2D$3.AC.C2.D2.C.CA$.2D.C.AD
.A.DA.C.2D$.2C.A2.A3.A2.A.2C$.CA.2D7.2D.AC$DC2.2A7.2A2.CD$2A15.2A!
#C [[ STOP 2 ]]
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Re: Find a rule game

Postby Macbi » September 10th, 2018, 6:39 am

Hunting wrote:
Sarp wrote:Week 4 Challenge
Find a 2 state rule and a shape fitting in a 10x10 bounding box so that the shape stabilises in as many generations as possible (A shape stabilizes when it becomes only still lifes, oscillators, spaceships, linear growths and/or replicators that won't interact with eachother). if the shape doesn't stabilise it doesn't qualify.

Hard! Very very very very HARD!
I'll post:
B3/S23, and this:
x = 6, y = 4, rule = B3/S23
ob3o$o4bo$obobo$bo2bo!

Hmmmm, It's 17465 gen.

There's Simon Ekström's 9-by-6 version of Lidka:
x = 9, y = 6, rule = B3/S23
6bo$6b3o2$3b2o3bo$3bo4bo$3o5bo!
(29126 generations)
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