## The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

For discussion of specific patterns or specific families of patterns, both newly-discovered and well-known.

### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

Extrementhusiast wrote:Well, here's one other way to get in, and it's Spartan, to boot...

Ah, much nicer. Will have to figure out how to add that to Spartan Hersrch at some point -- it would make a good compact delay conduit.

Except... haven't you just moved the problem back one step? Is there a Spartan way to deliver an R to that location? Even a Herschel receiver can't manage that trick. (?) (I may be behind the times again.)

So for the moment I'm looking at a full Herschel conduit along the lines of an Lx424:

`x = 81, y = 67, rule = B3/S2368b2o\$69bo\$69b3o6\$62b2o\$61bobo\$61bo\$60b2o2\$23b2o\$24bo14b2o\$24bobo12b2o9b2o\$25b2o23b2o2\$21b2o36b2o9b2o\$21bo37b2o9b2o\$22b3o\$24bo52bob2o\$77b2obo\$59b2o\$59b2o\$18b2o3b2o\$18bobobobo\$20bobo\$19b2ob2o\$75bo\$49b2o23bobo\$49b2o24b2o4\$14b2o\$13bo2bo2b2o\$13b3o2bobo\$16b2o\$13b2obo\$13bo2bo2bo\$14b3obobo57b2o\$18b2o58b2o\$16b2o\$17bo\$8bo8bobo29b2o\$8b3o7b2o29b2o\$11bo\$10b2o2\$75b2o\$75bo\$34b2o40b3o\$34b2o42bo2\$9bo\$9bobo\$9b3o\$11bo11b2o\$23bo\$24b3o\$26bo2\$2b2o\$3bo\$3o\$o!`

Definitely workable, but not so Spartan after all. Am I missing something?

dvgrn
Moderator

Posts: 5830
Joined: May 17th, 2009, 11:00 pm

### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

Unrelated to the above discussion, but I found an almost-transparent reaction between a Herschel and a ship, where the ship is converted into a block and pond before being changed into a boat in the same position as the ship:
`#C [[ AUTOSTART GPS 30 LOOP 175 ]]x = 24, y = 14, rule = LifeHistory22.2C\$21.C.C\$21.2C9\$3A\$.A\$.3A!`

Might it be possible to place a catalyst to interact with the spark to turn the boat into a loaf (and then use an eater to convert that) or directly into a ship?
Sphenocorona

Posts: 480
Joined: April 9th, 2013, 11:03 pm

### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

As a very lazy demonstration of the new technology I made this highway robber pattern:
`x = 236, y = 196, rule = LifeHistory119.2A\$118.A.A\$112.2A4.A\$110.A2.A2.2A.4A\$110.2A.A.A.A.A2.A\$113.A.ABABAB\$113.A.AB2AB\$114.AB.2B49.B2A\$117.3B46.2BA2BAB\$117.4B6.2A37.3B2A3B\$115.3B2AB6.A36.12B\$115.3B2AB3.BA.A35.14B\$113.10B.B2A37.13B\$112.13B39.14B\$111.14B38.15B\$110.15B38.14B\$109.4B2.8B40.13B\$108.4B5.6B40.B3D8B\$107.4B4.9B39.2BD5B\$106.4B5.2A4.4B38.2B3D2B\$105.4B7.A5.4B37.6B\$104.4B5.3A7.4B35.7B\$103.4B6.A10.4B33.8B\$102.4B19.4B31.8B\$101.4B21.4B29.9B\$100.4B23.4B27.D3B.6B\$99.4B25.4B25.D3B.7B\$84.A13.4B27.4B23.B3D2.6B\$84.3A10.4B29.4B21.4B3.6B\$87.A8.4B31.4B19.4B4.6B\$86.2A7.4B33.4B3.B2.A10.4B4.8B\$86.5B3.4B35.4B5.3A7.4B6.8B\$88.3B2.4B37.4B7.A5.4B6.9B\$78.2A7.9B39.4B5.2A4.4B7.9B\$78.A8.8B41.4B4.9B8.10B\$75.2A.A.B3.10B43.4B5.6B9.5B2A3B\$75.A2.3AB.2B2A7B44.4B2.8B9.5B2A4B\$76.2A2.BA3B2A7B45.15B7.11B\$78.4A12B46.14B7.12BA.2A\$78.A.2B3.7B.B2A45.13B4.2A3.8B2.2A.A\$40.2A37.3AB2.7B.BA.A45.10B.B2A2.A4.7B\$39.A.A40.A2.6B5.A47.3B2AB3.BA.A.A4.6B\$33.2A4.A37.5A3.6B5.2A46.3B2AB6.A.A.AB.6B\$31.A2.A2.2A.4A33.A7.B2.4B54.4B6.A2.2AB.7B\$31.2A.A.A.A.A2.A35.A9.4B53.3B6.2A4.9B\$34.A.ABABAB36.2A10.4B49.AB.2B14.10B\$34.A.AB2AB50.4B47.A.AB2AB13.11B\$35.AB.2B52.4B46.A.ABABAB8.B4.12B\$38.3B26.2A11.A12.4B42.2A.A.A.A.A2.A5.A2B.B.13B\$38.4B6.2A16.B2AB9.A.A12.4B41.A2.A2.2A.4A4.A.A18B\$36.3B2AB6.A18.3B9.A.A2.2A3.A5.4B42.2A4.A9.AB.17B\$36.3B2AB3.BA.A17.B.B9.2A.2A2.A2.A.A5.4B47.A.A10.16B\$34.10B.B2A18.5B8.B2.A.A3.A.A6.4B47.2A10.16B\$33.13B20.6B6.2ABA2.4A.A8.4B51.2A6.15B\$32.14B20.8B4.2A.A.A3.A11.4B51.A8.14B\$31.15B21.13B2.A.AB2.A11.4B50.A.AB2.B.12B.B2A\$22.A7.4B2.8B21.14B4.A.A2B.A3.A7.4B50.2AB.15B.BA.A\$20.3A6.4B5.6B20.15B5.A2B.2A3.3A6.4B51.17B4.A\$19.A8.4B4.9B19.15B4.3B10.A6.4B50.19B2.2A\$18.A.A6.4B5.2A4.4B17.17B.B.2B10.2A7.4B50.18B\$17.BA.A5.4B7.A5.4B16.29B3.5B5.4B50.18B\$16.3BA5.4B5.3A7.4B14.13B2A11BD4B4.5B4.4B43.A7.16B\$14.4B6.4B6.A10.4B12.14B2A9B3D4B2.7B5.4B41.A.A6.16B\$12.6B5.4B19.4B10.2AB3.20BDBD4B.9B5.4B40.A.A7.13B.B2A\$11.7B4.4B21.4B8.A2.A4.19BD15B7.4B37.3A.2A5.9B3.B2.BA.A\$4.B.4B.8B2.4B23.B3D6.A.2A5.6B3.B2.2B2.20B7.4B35.A4.B5.10B9.A\$3.2AB.17B25.D3B5.A7.6B14.18B7.4B35.3AB2AB2.11B9.2A\$3.2A18B27.D3B3.2A6.9B14.17B7.4B36.A.2A14B\$4.2B.16B28.4B9.4B4.2A15.17B7.4B10.2A7.2A16.18B\$7.16B29.4B7.4B5.A16.18B7.4B8.B2A2B5.A.A17.15B2A\$8.15B30.4B5.4B7.3A11.8B.12B7.4B8.4B2.BA.A.3A14.16B2A\$9.12B.B2A29.4B3.4B10.A11.2A3.B3.13B7.4B5.7B.B2A5.A13.17B\$9.11B2.BA.A29.4B.4B24.A7.14B7.4B3.11B5.2A13.17B\$10.10B5.A30.7B22.3A8.15B7.4B3.9B6.4B10.17B\$10.6B2A2B5.2A30.5B23.A10.16B7.4B2.12B5.3B8.18B\$10.6B2A3B36.5B32.19B7.4B.16B.4B6.17B.B2A\$10.10B36.7B29.17B.4B7.34B2.11B2.BA.A\$6.A.2AB.8B35.4B.4B27.2A28B.27BD4B2.11B6.A\$4.3AB2AB3.7B33.4B3.4B25.A.AB.22BD4B.24B3D4B2.11B6.2A\$3.A4.B6.6B32.4B5.4B24.A4.20B3D4B2.23BDBD4B.12B\$4.3A.2A4.6B32.4B7.4B22.2A3.D20BDBD4B.24BD20B\$6.2A2.A4.5B31.4B9.4B25.D21BD21B3.2B2.23B\$9.A.A.8B28.5B11.4B23.B3D10B2.2B2.22B11.21B\$5.A.2A.A.A8B27.5B13.4B21.4B2.8B10.17B12.4B.17B\$5.2A.A.BA2B.6B27.5B14.4B19.4B4.7B12.16B10.4B3.16B\$8.A2.2B2.2B3D2B25.8B7.A5.4B6.A10.4B6.5B12.18B8.4B3.17B\$8.2A.B3.2BD4B.2B21.9B5.3A6.4B5.3A7.4B5.6B13.19B6.4B4.16B\$6.2A2.A.A2.B3D7B19.10B4.A10.4B7.A5.4B6.2A18.19B4.4B3.2AB.3B3.7B\$5.A2.A2.2A2.13B16.11B4.2A10.4B5.2A4.4B8.A19.6B.12B2.4B3.A.AB7.6B\$6.2A7.14B14.12B2.4B11.4B4.9B6.3A20.6B.17B4.A12.B.3B\$15.14B13.17B14.4B5.6B7.A23.4B4.7B.6B4.2A12.2BA3B\$16.14B11.13B2A2B2A14.4B2.8B33.B3.8B3.4B17.2A.A.A2.A\$19.10B11.14B2A.B2A15.15B35.2A4.2B2.6B16.2A.A.4A\$18.10B4.2A5.16B3.B17.14B36.A7.D7B18.2A\$10.B3.B.10B6.A5.4B.B3D5B25.13B33.3A7.BDBD2.4B14.2A4.5A\$9.19B.BA.A4.4B2.2BD5B27.10B.B2A26.A4.A8.2B2D4.4B13.A6.A2.A\$7.B.19B.B2A4.4B3.2B3D2B30.3B2AB3.BA.A25.3A10.4B6.4B13.A3.A\$6.2A22B5.4B4.6B31.3B2AB6.A28.A8.4B8.4B11.2A3.2A\$6.2A22B4.4B4.7B33.4B6.2A26.2A7.4B10.4B\$7.23B3.4B4.8B33.3B35.5B3.4B12.4B\$7.23B2.4B4.8B31.AB.2B38.3B2.4B14.4B\$9.26B4.9B30.A.AB2AB27.2A7.9B16.4B7.A\$10.11B2.11B4.4B.6B29.A.ABABAB26.A8.8B18.4B6.3A\$8.13B3.9B4.4B.7B26.2A.A.A.A.A2.A2.A18.2A.A.B3.10B20.4B8.A\$8.2AB.8B4.3B.4B4.4B2.6B28.A.A2.2A.9A16.A2.3AB.2B2A7B21.4B6.A.A\$9.A2.8B5.B.4B4.4B3.6B28.A.A4.A9.A16.2A2.BA3B2A7B22.4B5.A.AB\$6.3A3.8B6.4B4.4B4.6B27.2A.2A3.A.4A.3A8.2A9.4A12B23.4B5.A3B\$6.A6.6B6.4B4.4B4.8B29.A2.A.A.A2.A.A9.B2AB8.A.2B3.7B.B2A22.4B6.4B\$7.2A4.6B5.4B4.4B6.8B28.A.2A.A.A2.A.A9.3B10.3AB2.7B.BA.A22.4B5.6B\$8.A4.6B4.4B4.4B6.9B16.A9.2A.A2.A2.A.2A.2A9.B.B12.A.7B5.A6.A16.4B4.7B\$8.A.AB.7B2.4B4.4B7.9B16.3A6.A.A.A.A3.A.A2.B8.5B7.5A.8B5.2A3.3A17.4B2.8B.4B.B\$9.2AB2.6B.4B4.4B8.10B18.A6.A3.A.4A2.AB2A6.6B7.A10.4B8.A21.17B.B2A\$11.8B.4B4.4B9.5B2A3B17.2A12.A3.A.A.2A4.8B9.A9.4B7.2A21.18B2A\$11.12B4.4B10.5B2A4B3.2A11.4B9.A2.BA.A2.13B9.2A10.4B3.5B21.16B.2B\$12.10B4.4B11.11B3.A14.3B7.A.2BA.A5.13B20.4B2.3B23.16B\$13.8B4.4B12.4BD7BA.A13.4B7.2A.2BA5.15B20.9B7.2A13.15B\$14.8B.5B15.B3D4B2.2A4.2A8.5B10.3B4.15B21.8B8.A11.2AB.12B\$14.13B10.2A4.D2B2D2B9.A8.6B11.2B.B.17B21.10B3.B.A.2A7.A.AB2.11B\$9.A4.12B12.A4.6B7.BA.A8.8B2.29B21.7B2A2B.B3A2.A7.A5.10B\$7.3A3.14B11.A.AB.6B3.3B.B2A8.14BD11B2A13B20.7B2A3BAB2.2A7.2A5.2B2A6B\$6.A5.16B11.2AB.14B11.13B3D9B2A14B19.12B4A15.3B2A6B\$6.2A3.18B12.16B12.7B.4BDBD20B3.B2A16.2AB.7B3.2B.A16.10B\$3.5B2.20B12.14B12.15BD19B4.A2.A14.A.AB.7B2.B3A17.8B.B2A.A\$2.4B.6B2.14B12.16B11.19B2.2B2.B3.6B5.2A.A13.A5.4B4.A19.7B3.B2AB3A\$2.10B4.12B13.18B8.17B14.6B7.A12.2A5.4B5.5A7.A6.6B6.B4.A\$.28B13.20B2.2B.15B14.9B6.2A17.4B10.A7.3A5.6B4.2A.3A\$30B13.15BD22B15.2A4.4B23.4B9.A12.A4.5B4.A2.2A\$31B13.7B.4BDBD13B.8B16.A5.4B21.4B10.2A9.B2AB2.8B.A.A\$32B.B10.6B2.4B3D9B2A2B3.8B11.3A7.4B19.4B23.4B.8BA.A.2A.A\$.30B.B2A8.6B3.4BD11B2A2B5.B3.2A11.A10.4B17.4B25.10B.2BAB.A.2A\$2.6B2C23B2A8.4B6.18B10.A24.4B15.4B27.4B3D2B2.2B2.A\$3.4BC2BC20B.2B9.2B2AB12.4B.3B.B12.3A22.4B13.4B29.5BD2B3.B.2A15.A\$3.4BCBC22B9.2AB.2A14.4B19.A23.4B11.4B27.2B.4B3DB2.A.A2.2A11.3A\$4.4BC3B3.18B7.A.AB18.3B44.4B9.4B26.13B2.2A2.A2.A9.A\$6.4B5.19B6.A23.B2A43.4B7.4B27.13B7.2A10.2A\$5.4B6.15B.4B4.2A23.BA.A43.4B5.4B27.14B17.4B\$5.4B5.15B3.4B31.A44.4B3.4B29.14B15.3B19.A\$6.B3C4.16B3.4B30.2A44.4B.4B29.10B2.4B14.4B18.3A\$7.C.2B3.16B4.4B76.7B28.B.11B2.4B12.5B9.A11.A\$8.C3B2.15B6.4B76.5B28.2A14B.4B11.6B8.3A8.2A5.4B\$9.4B2.4B.9B7.4B75.5B28.2A26B2.8B11.A7.11B\$10.4B7.6B10.4B73.7B28.23BD14B9.2A3.B5.11B\$11.4B8.4B11.4B71.4B.4B27.21B3D13B10.8B2.11B2A\$12.4B8.2B13.4B69.4B3.4B30.17BDBD4B.7B13.19B2A\$13.4B23.4B67.4B5.4B29.2A15BD15B12.20B\$14.4B23.4B65.4B7.4B25.B.B2A6B2.2B2.19B11.20B\$15.4B23.4B63.4B9.4B23.2A8B11.17B8.21B\$16.4B23.4B61.4B11.4B22.2AB.4B15.15B.2B2.25B\$17.4B23.4B59.4B13.4B22.B3.2B17.22BD14B4.4B\$18.4B23.4B57.4B15.4B26.2B16.8B.13BDBD4B.6B6.4B\$19.4B23.4B55.4B17.4B24.B2AB13.8B3.2B2A9B3D4B2.B.5B5.4B\$20.4B23.4B53.4B19.4B24.2A14.2A3.B5.2B2A11BD4B7.2A6.4B\$21.4B23.4B51.4B21.4B40.A10.18B8.A8.4B\$22.4B23.4B49.4B23.4B36.3A12.B.3B.4B16.3A6.4B\$23.4B23.4B47.4B25.4B35.A19.4B19.A7.4B\$24.4B23.4B45.4B27.4B53.4B29.4B\$25.4B23.4B43.4B29.4B51.4B31.4B\$26.4B23.4B41.4B31.4B49.4B33.4B\$27.4B23.4B39.4B33.4B47.4B35.4B\$28.4B23.4B37.4B35.4B45.4B37.4B\$29.4B23.4B35.4B37.4B43.4B39.4B\$30.4B23.4B33.4B39.4B41.4B41.4B\$31.4B23.4B31.4B41.4B39.4B43.4B\$32.4B23.4B29.4B43.4B37.4B45.4B\$33.4B23.4B27.4B45.4B35.4B47.4B\$34.4B23.4B25.4B47.4B33.4B49.4B\$35.4B23.4B23.4B49.4B31.4B51.4B\$36.4B23.4B21.4B51.4B29.4B53.3B\$37.4B23.4B19.4B53.4B27.4B55.2B\$38.4B23.4B6.A10.4B55.4B25.4B57.B\$39.4B23.4B5.3A7.4B57.4B23.4B\$40.4B23.4B7.A5.4B59.4B21.4B\$41.4B23.4B5.2A4.4B61.4B19.4B\$42.4B23.4B4.9B63.4B6.A10.4B\$43.4B23.4B5.6B65.4B5.3A7.4B\$44.4B23.4B2.8B66.4B7.A5.4B\$45.4B23.15B65.4B5.2A4.4B\$46.4B23.14B66.4B4.9B\$47.4B23.13B67.4B5.6B\$48.B26.10B.B2A66.4B2.8B\$77.3B2AB3.BA.A66.15B\$77.3B2AB6.A67.14B\$79.4B6.2A67.13B\$79.3B77.10B.B2A\$76.AB.2B80.3B2AB3.BA.A\$75.A.AB2AB79.3B2AB6.A\$75.A.ABABAB80.4B6.2A\$72.2A.A.A.A.A2.A78.3B\$72.A2.A2.2A.4A75.AB.2B\$74.2A4.A78.A.AB2AB\$80.A.A76.A.ABABAB\$81.2A73.2A.A.A.A.A2.A\$156.A2.A2.2A.4A\$158.2A4.A\$164.A.A\$165.2A!`

There's probably a lot of optimization issues with it, and it's slower than already existing ones (repeat time 2808 or so), but after putting a good few hours into this, it'd be pretty pointless to just get rid of it.

Also, maybe a new elementary conduit stamp collection is in order, featuring all the new conduits along with the old?

EDIT: Fixed an uncleaned block. No idea how the relevant eater disappeared.
Last edited by Sphenocorona on March 28th, 2015, 4:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
Sphenocorona

Posts: 480
Joined: April 9th, 2013, 11:03 pm

### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

Sphenocorona wrote:As a very lazy demonstration of the new technology I made this highway robber pattern:
`x = 225, y = 196, rule = LifeHistory119.2A\$118.A.A\$112.2A4.A\$110.A2.A2.2A.4A\$110.2A.A.A.A.A2.A\$113.A.ABABAB\$113.A.AB2AB\$114.AB.2B49.B2A\$117.3B46.2BA2BAB\$117.4B6.2A37.3B2A3B\$115.3B2AB6.A36.12B\$115.3B2AB3.BA.A35.14B\$113.10B.B2A37.13B\$112.13B39.14B\$111.14B38.15B\$110.15B38.14B\$109.4B2.8B40.13B\$108.4B5.6B40.B3D8B\$107.4B4.9B39.2BD5B\$106.4B5.2A4.4B38.2B3D2B\$105.4B7.A5.4B37.6B\$104.4B5.3A7.4B35.7B\$103.4B6.A10.4B33.8B\$102.4B19.4B31.8B\$101.4B21.4B29.9B\$100.4B23.4B27.D3B.6B\$99.4B25.4B25.D3B.7B\$84.A13.4B27.4B23.B3D2.6B\$84.3A10.4B29.4B21.4B3.6B\$87.A8.4B31.4B19.4B4.6B\$86.2A7.4B33.4B3.B2.A10.4B4.8B\$86.5B3.4B35.4B5.3A7.4B6.8B\$88.3B2.4B37.4B7.A5.4B6.9B\$78.2A7.9B39.4B5.2A4.4B7.9B\$78.A8.8B41.4B4.9B8.10B\$75.2A.A.B3.10B43.4B5.6B9.5B2A3B\$75.A2.3AB.2B2A7B44.4B2.8B9.5B2A4B\$76.2A2.BA3B2A7B45.15B7.11B\$78.4A12B46.14B7.12BA.2A\$78.A.2B3.7B.B2A45.13B4.2A3.8B2.2A.A\$40.2A37.3AB2.7B.BA.A45.10B.B2A2.A4.7B\$39.A.A40.A2.6B5.A47.3B2AB3.BA.A.A4.6B\$33.2A4.A37.5A3.6B5.2A46.3B2AB6.A.A.AB.6B\$31.A2.A2.2A.4A33.A7.B2.4B54.4B6.A2.2AB.7B\$31.2A.A.A.A.A2.A35.A9.4B53.3B6.2A4.9B\$34.A.ABABAB36.2A10.4B49.AB.2B14.10B\$34.A.AB2AB50.4B47.A.AB2AB13.11B\$35.AB.2B52.4B46.A.ABABAB8.B4.12B\$38.3B26.2A11.A12.4B42.2A.A.A.A.A2.A5.A2B.B.13B\$38.4B6.2A16.B2AB9.A.A12.4B41.A2.A2.2A.4A4.A.A18B\$36.3B2AB6.A18.3B9.A.A2.2A3.A5.4B42.2A4.A9.AB.17B\$36.3B2AB3.BA.A17.B.B9.2A.2A2.A2.A.A5.4B47.A.A10.16B\$34.10B.B2A18.5B8.B2.A.A3.A.A6.4B47.2A10.16B\$33.13B20.6B6.2ABA2.4A.A8.4B51.2A6.15B\$32.14B20.8B4.2A.A.A3.A11.4B51.A8.14B\$31.15B21.13B2.A.AB2.A11.4B50.A.AB2.B.12B.B2A\$22.A7.4B2.8B21.14B4.A.A2B.A3.A7.4B50.2AB.15B.BA.A\$20.3A6.4B5.6B20.15B5.A2B.2A3.3A6.4B51.17B4.A\$19.A8.4B4.9B19.15B4.3B10.A6.4B50.19B2.2A\$18.A.A6.4B5.2A4.4B17.17B.B.2B10.2A7.4B50.18B\$17.BA.A5.4B7.A5.4B16.29B3.5B5.4B50.18B\$16.3BA5.4B5.3A7.4B14.13B2A11BD4B4.5B4.4B43.A7.16B\$14.4B6.4B6.A10.4B12.14B2A9B3D4B2.7B5.4B41.A.A6.16B\$12.6B5.4B19.4B10.2AB3.20BDBD4B.9B5.4B40.A.A7.13B.B2A\$11.7B4.4B21.4B8.A2.A4.19BD15B7.4B37.3A.2A5.9B3.B2.BA.A\$4.B.4B.8B2.4B23.B3D6.A.2A5.6B3.B2.2B2.20B7.4B35.A4.B5.10B9.A\$3.2AB.17B25.D3B5.A7.6B14.18B7.4B35.3AB2AB2.11B9.2A\$3.2A18B27.D3B3.2A6.9B14.17B7.4B36.A.2A14B\$4.2B.16B28.4B9.4B4.2A15.17B7.4B10.2A7.2A16.18B\$7.16B29.4B7.4B5.A16.18B7.4B8.B2A2B5.A.A17.15B2A\$8.15B30.4B5.4B7.3A11.8B.12B7.4B8.4B2.BA.A.3A14.16B2A\$9.12B.B2A29.4B3.4B10.A11.2A3.B3.13B7.4B5.7B.B2A5.A13.17B\$9.11B2.BA.A29.4B.4B24.A7.14B7.4B3.11B5.2A13.17B\$10.10B5.A30.7B22.3A8.15B7.4B3.9B6.4B10.17B\$10.6B2A2B5.2A30.5B23.A10.16B7.4B2.12B5.3B8.18B\$10.6B2A3B36.5B32.19B7.4B.16B.4B6.17B.B2A\$10.10B36.7B29.17B.4B7.34B2.11B2.BA.A\$6.A.2AB.8B35.4B.4B27.2A28B.27BD4B2.11B6.A\$4.3AB2AB3.7B33.4B3.4B25.A.AB.22BD4B.24B3D4B2.11B6.2A\$3.A4.B6.6B32.4B5.4B24.A4.20B3D4B2.23BDBD4B.12B\$4.3A.2A4.6B32.4B7.4B22.2A3.D20BDBD4B.24BD20B\$6.2A2.A4.5B31.4B9.4B25.D21BD21B3.2B2.23B\$9.A.A.8B28.5B11.4B23.B3D10B2.2B2.22B11.21B\$5.A.2A.A.A8B27.5B13.4B21.4B2.8B10.17B12.4B.17B\$5.2A.A.BA2B.6B27.5B14.4B19.4B4.7B12.16B10.4B3.16B\$8.A2.2B2.2B3D2B25.8B7.A5.4B6.A10.4B6.5B12.18B8.4B3.17B\$8.2A.B3.2BD4B.2B21.9B5.3A6.4B5.3A7.4B5.6B13.19B6.4B4.16B\$6.2A2.A.A2.B3D7B19.10B4.A10.4B7.A5.4B6.2A18.19B4.4B3.2AB.3B3.7B\$5.A2.A2.2A2.13B16.11B4.2A10.4B5.2A4.4B8.A19.6B.12B2.4B3.A.AB7.6B\$6.2A7.14B14.12B2.4B11.4B4.9B6.3A20.6B.17B4.A12.B.3B\$15.14B13.17B14.4B5.6B7.A23.4B4.7B.6B4.2A12.2BA3B\$16.14B11.13B2A2B2A14.4B2.8B33.B3.8B3.4B17.2A.A.A2.A\$19.10B11.14B2A.B2A15.15B35.2A4.2B2.6B16.2A.A.4A\$18.10B4.2A5.16B3.B17.14B36.A7.D7B18.2A\$10.B3.B.10B6.A5.4B.B3D5B25.13B33.3A7.BDBD2.4B14.2A4.5A\$9.19B.BA.A4.4B2.2BD5B27.10B.B2A26.A4.A8.2B2D4.4B13.A6.A2.A\$7.B.19B.B2A4.4B3.2B3D2B30.3B2AB3.BA.A25.3A10.4B6.4B13.A3.A\$6.2A22B5.4B4.6B31.3B2AB6.A28.A8.4B8.4B11.2A3.2A\$6.2A22B4.4B4.7B33.4B6.2A26.2A7.4B10.4B\$7.23B3.4B4.8B33.3B35.5B3.4B12.4B\$7.23B2.4B4.8B31.AB.2B38.3B2.4B14.4B\$9.26B4.9B30.A.AB2AB27.2A7.9B16.4B7.A\$10.11B2.11B4.4B.6B29.A.ABABAB26.A8.8B18.4B6.3A\$8.13B3.9B4.4B.7B26.2A.A.A.A.A2.A2.A18.2A.A.B3.10B20.4B8.A\$8.2AB.8B4.3B.4B4.4B2.6B28.A.A2.2A.9A16.A2.3AB.2B2A7B21.4B6.A.A\$9.A2.8B5.B.4B4.4B3.6B28.A.A4.A9.A16.2A2.BA3B2A7B22.4B5.A.AB\$6.3A3.8B6.4B4.4B4.6B27.2A.2A3.A.4A.3A8.2A9.4A12B23.4B5.A3B\$6.A6.6B6.4B4.4B4.8B29.A2.A.A.A2.A.A9.B2AB8.A.2B3.7B.B2A22.4B6.4B\$7.2A4.6B5.4B4.4B6.8B28.A.2A.A.A2.A.A9.3B10.3AB2.7B.BA.A22.4B5.6B\$8.A4.6B4.4B4.4B6.9B16.A9.2A.A2.A2.A.2A.2A9.B.B12.A.7B5.A6.A16.4B4.7B\$8.A.AB.7B2.4B4.4B7.9B16.3A6.A.A.A.A3.A.A2.B8.5B7.5A.8B5.2A3.3A17.4B2.8B.4B.B\$9.2AB2.6B.4B4.4B8.10B18.A6.A3.A.4A2.AB2A6.6B7.A10.4B8.A21.17B.B2A\$11.8B.4B4.4B9.5B2A3B17.2A12.A3.A.A.2A4.8B9.A9.4B7.2A21.18B2A\$11.12B4.4B10.5B2A4B3.2A11.4B9.A2.BA.A2.13B9.2A10.4B3.5B21.16B.2B\$12.10B4.4B11.11B3.A14.3B7.A.2BA.A5.13B20.4B2.3B23.16B\$13.8B4.4B12.4BD7BA.A13.4B7.2A.2BA5.15B20.9B7.2A13.15B\$14.8B.5B15.B3D4B2.2A14.5B10.3B4.15B21.8B8.A11.2AB.12B\$14.13B10.2A4.D2B2D2B18.6B11.2B.B.17B21.10B3.B.A.2A7.A.AB2.11B\$9.A4.12B12.A4.6B19.8B2.29B21.7B2A2B.B3A2.A7.A5.10B\$7.3A3.14B11.A.AB.6B3.4B11.14BD11B2A13B20.7B2A3BAB2.2A7.2A5.2B2A6B\$6.A5.16B11.2AB.12B2A11.13B3D9B2A14B19.12B4A15.3B2A6B\$6.2A3.18B12.14B2A12.7B.4BDBD20B3.B2A16.2AB.7B3.2B.A16.10B\$3.5B2.20B12.14B12.15BD19B4.A2.A14.A.AB.7B2.B3A17.8B.B2A.A\$2.4B.6B2.14B12.16B11.19B2.2B2.B3.6B5.2A.A13.A5.4B4.A19.7B3.B2AB3A\$2.10B4.12B13.18B8.17B14.6B7.A12.2A5.4B5.5A7.A6.6B6.B4.A\$.28B13.20B2.2B.15B14.9B6.2A17.4B10.A7.3A5.6B4.2A.3A\$30B13.15BD22B15.2A4.4B23.4B9.A12.A4.5B4.A2.2A\$31B13.7B.4BDBD13B.8B16.A5.4B21.4B10.2A9.B2AB2.8B.A.A\$32B.B10.6B2.4B3D9B2A2B3.8B11.3A7.4B19.4B23.4B.8BA.A.2A.A\$.30B.B2A8.6B3.4BD11B2A2B5.B3.2A11.A10.4B17.4B25.10B.2BAB.A.2A\$2.6B2C23B2A8.4B6.18B10.A24.4B15.4B27.4B3D2B2.2B2.A\$3.4BC2BC20B.2B9.2B2AB12.4B.3B.B12.3A22.4B13.4B29.5BD2B3.B.2A15.A\$3.4BCBC22B9.2AB.2A14.4B19.A23.4B11.4B27.2B.4B3DB2.A.A2.2A11.3A\$4.4BC3B3.18B7.A.AB18.3B44.4B9.4B26.13B2.2A2.A2.A9.A\$6.4B5.19B6.A23.B2A43.4B7.4B27.13B7.2A10.2A\$5.2BAB6.15B.4B4.2A23.BA.A43.4B5.4B27.14B17.4B\$5.B2AB5.15B3.4B31.A44.4B3.4B29.14B15.3B19.A\$6.ABAB4.16B3.4B30.2A44.4B.4B29.10B2.4B14.4B18.3A\$7.4B3.16B4.4B76.7B28.B.11B2.4B12.5B9.A11.A\$8.4B2.15B6.4B76.5B28.2A14B.4B11.6B8.3A8.2A5.4B\$9.4B2.4B.9B7.4B75.5B28.2A26B2.8B11.A7.11B\$10.4B7.6B10.4B73.7B28.23BD14B9.2A3.B5.11B\$11.4B8.4B11.4B71.4B.4B27.21B3D13B10.8B2.11B2A\$12.4B8.2B13.4B69.4B3.4B30.17BDBD4B.7B13.19B2A\$13.4B23.4B67.4B5.4B29.2A15BD15B12.20B\$14.4B23.4B65.4B7.4B25.B.B2A6B2.2B2.19B11.20B\$15.4B23.4B63.4B9.4B23.2A8B11.17B8.21B\$16.4B23.4B61.4B11.4B22.2AB.4B15.15B.2B2.25B\$17.4B23.4B59.4B13.4B22.B3.2B17.22BD14B4.4B\$18.4B23.4B57.4B15.4B26.2B16.8B.13BDBD4B.6B6.4B\$19.4B23.4B55.4B17.4B24.B2AB13.8B3.2B2A9B3D4B2.B.5B5.4B\$20.4B23.4B53.4B19.4B24.2A14.2A3.B5.2B2A11BD4B7.2A6.4B\$21.4B23.4B51.4B21.4B40.A10.18B8.A8.4B\$22.4B23.4B49.4B23.4B36.3A12.B.3B.4B16.3A6.4B\$23.4B23.4B47.4B25.4B35.A19.4B19.A7.4B\$24.4B23.4B45.4B27.4B53.4B29.4B\$25.4B23.4B43.4B29.4B51.4B31.3B\$26.4B23.4B41.4B31.4B49.4B33.2B\$27.4B23.4B39.4B33.4B47.4B35.B\$28.4B23.4B37.4B35.4B45.4B\$29.4B23.4B35.4B37.4B43.4B\$30.4B23.4B33.4B39.4B41.4B\$31.4B23.4B31.4B41.4B39.4B\$32.4B23.4B29.4B43.4B37.4B\$33.4B23.4B27.4B45.4B35.4B\$34.4B23.4B25.4B47.4B33.4B\$35.4B23.4B23.4B49.4B31.4B\$36.4B23.4B21.4B51.4B29.4B\$37.4B23.4B19.4B53.4B27.4B\$38.4B23.4B6.A10.4B55.4B25.4B\$39.4B23.4B5.3A7.4B57.4B23.4B\$40.4B23.4B7.A5.4B59.4B21.4B\$41.4B23.4B5.2A4.4B61.4B19.4B\$42.4B23.4B4.9B63.4B6.A10.4B\$43.4B23.4B5.6B65.4B5.3A7.4B\$44.4B23.4B2.8B66.4B7.A5.4B\$45.4B23.15B65.4B5.2A4.4B\$46.4B23.14B66.4B4.9B\$47.4B23.13B67.4B5.6B\$48.B26.10B.B2A66.4B2.8B\$77.3B2AB3.BA.A66.15B\$77.3B2AB6.A67.14B\$79.4B6.2A67.13B\$79.3B77.10B.B2A\$76.AB.2B80.3B2AB3.BA.A\$75.A.AB2AB79.3B2AB6.A\$75.A.ABABAB80.4B6.2A\$72.2A.A.A.A.A2.A78.3B\$72.A2.A2.2A.4A75.AB.2B\$74.2A4.A78.A.AB2AB\$80.A.A76.A.ABABAB\$81.2A73.2A.A.A.A.A2.A\$156.A2.A2.2A.4A\$158.2A4.A\$164.A.A\$165.2A!`

There's probably a lot of optimization issues with it, and it's slower than already existing ones (repeat time 2808 or so), but after putting a good few hours into this, it'd be pretty pointless to just get rid of it.

Also, maybe a new elementary conduit stamp collection is in order, featuring all the new conduits along with the old?

There's an uncleaned block in that pattern (next to the B); as a result the conduit chain that resets the loaf breaks partway. Also, gnarly weld.
Physics: sophistication from simplicity.

biggiemac

Posts: 504
Joined: September 17th, 2014, 12:21 am
Location: California, USA

### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

Fixed the break in the conduit. That weld was truly exasperating to make - I might have spent around half an hour on that one part alone. But that weld is the simplest one I could find.

The bounding box can be easily reduced to some extent by replacing some of the edge snarks with a chain of multiple snarks. The use of the new R421 was probably total overkill in trying to delay the right side gliders, but it worked.
Sphenocorona

Posts: 480
Joined: April 9th, 2013, 11:03 pm

### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

Sphenocorona wrote:The bounding box can be easily reduced to some extent by replacing some of the edge snarks with a chain of multiple snarks. The use of the new R421 was probably total overkill in trying to delay the right side gliders, but it worked.

As a demonstration of new technology, it seems fine the way it is -- no need to worry about bounding boxes.

If a reduction in size or repeat time is wanted, it will probably make sense to really restart from scratch. Looking at that three-stage rebuild of a loaf, I don't know why I ever thought that that was a good idea... the initial highway-robber reaction is nice and quick, but recovery is bound to be painfully slow. I seem to recall it was supposed to be a proof-of-concept, just to show that it was possible to snag a glider from one lane and leave gliders in adjacent lanes untouched.

With all the Bellman/ptbsearch/catgl activity lately, it seems quite possible that someone could dig up a much better H->bait converter -- either a direct H-to-loaf, or any other constellation that can be generated cleanly at the very edge of its reaction envelope by a H-to-junk converter, and that collapses fairly cleanly into a 90-degree glider. Anyone have any likely candidates lying around?

There are so many H-to-junk converters that show up in conduit searches, that one of them is bound to be just what we want... the problem is figuring out how to be reasonably efficient at testing and discarding all the other thousands of candidates. It would be nice to have an organized H->junk converter collection set up; pretty much any converter where the junk is right at the edge of its reaction envelope, with no catalysts in the way, has a small but nonzero probability of being useful to somebody sometime.

Sphenocorona wrote:Also, maybe a new elementary conduit stamp collection is in order, featuring all the new conduits along with the old?

Definitely! An update of Calcyman's collection would make a lot of sense now, with more readable labels for the sections.

A rebuild of the Herschel-conduit pattern in Golly's Signal-Circuitry folder is also long overdue -- none of Guam's discoveries are in there yet, even. Maybe the two should be combined into one large stamp collection, with some kind of labeling or index for the Herschel conduits, marking the locations of all the intermediate objects. It's really useful to see examples of how each elementary conduit can actually be used.

If someone wants to undertake the project, I'll check in the completed stamp collection to Golly immediately...!

dvgrn
Moderator

Posts: 5830
Joined: May 17th, 2009, 11:00 pm

### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

Copying Calcyman's H->Loaf from here and applying recent discoveries gives a 911 tick Highway Robber:

`x = 101, y = 73, rule = B3/S2327b2o11bo\$27b2o10bobo\$39bobo2b2o3bo\$38b2ob2o2bo2bobo\$42bobo3bobo\$38b2obo2b4obo\$38b2obobo3bo\$42bobo3bo\$43bobo3bo\$44bo3b2o\$63bo\$61b3o\$60bo9bo\$35b2o23b2o6b3o\$35b2o30bo\$20b2o45b2o\$19bo2bo48b2o\$18bob2o49bo\$18bo50bobo\$17b2o50b2o\$32b2o\$32bo\$33b3o\$35bo11b2o23bo\$48bo22bobo\$45b3o8b2o14bo\$45bo11bo\$7bo46b3o\$7b3o44bo\$10bo\$o8b2o\$3o\$3bo\$2b2o15b2o\$19b2o40b2o28bo\$62bo26b3o\$47bo11b3o26bo\$45b3o11bo28b2o\$44bo\$44b2o\$50b2o44b2o\$9b2o39b2o7bo37bo\$8bo2bo45b3o37bob2o\$8bobo45bo32b2o4b3o2bo\$9bo46b2o31b2o3bo3b2o\$94b4o\$64b2o14b2o15bo\$64bo10b2o2bobo12b3o\$62bobo11bo2bo13bo\$62b2o10bo2b3o14b5o\$74b3o21bo\$77bo18bo\$76b2o18b2o\$91b2o\$91bo\$88b2obo\$87bo2bo\$88b2o\$73b2o\$40b2o31b2o\$40bo\$41b3o6b2o\$43bo2b2o2b2o\$43bobobo12b2o3bo\$24b3o15b2obo14bo3bobo\$24bo17bo2bo15bo3bobo\$25bo17b2o17bo3bobob2o\$60bob4o2bob2o\$59bobo3bobo\$59bobo2bo2b2ob2o\$60bo3b2o2bobo\$68bobo10b2o\$69bo11b2o!`
chris_c

Posts: 905
Joined: June 28th, 2014, 7:15 am

### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

chris_c wrote:Copying Calcyman's H->Loaf from here and applying recent discoveries gives a 911 tick Highway Robber...

Sub-1000-tick recovery is pretty impressive for a single-lane highway robber... Hmm, it's not too easy to actually get an output signal from it at that repeat rate, is it?

`x = 172, y = 153, rule = B3/S2342b2o11bo\$42b2o10bobo\$54bobo2b2o3bo\$53b2ob2o2bo2bobo\$57bobo3bobo\$53b2obo2b4obo\$53b2obobo3bo\$57bobo3bo\$58bobo3bo\$59bo3b2o\$78bo\$76b3o\$3b2o70bo9bo\$4bo45b2o23b2o6b3o\$2bo47b2o30bo\$2b5o14b2o12b2o45b2o\$7bo13bo12bo2bo48b2o\$4b3o12bobo11bob2o49bo\$3bo15b2o12bo50bobo\$3b4o25b2o50b2o\$b2o3bo3b2o35b2o\$o2b3o4b2o35bo\$2obo44b3o\$3bo46bo11b2o23bo\$3b2o58bo22bobo\$60b3o8b2o14bo\$60bo11bo\$11b2o56b3o\$12bo56bo\$9b3o\$9bo5bo\$15b3o\$18bo\$17b2o15b2o\$34b2o40b2o28bo\$77bo26b3o\$62bo11b3o26bo\$60b3o11bo28b2o\$59bo\$59b2o\$65b2o44b2o\$24b2o39b2o7bo37bo\$23bo2bo45b3o37bob2o\$23bobo45bo32b2o4b3o2bo\$24bo46b2o31b2o3bo3b2o\$109b4o\$79b2o14b2o15bo\$79bo10b2o2bobo12b3o\$77bobo11bo2bo13bo\$77b2o10bo2b3o14b5o\$89b3o21bo\$92bo18bo\$91b2o18b2o\$106b2o\$106bo\$103b2obo\$102bo2bo\$103b2o\$88b2o\$55b2o31b2o\$55bo\$56b3o6b2o\$58bo2b2o2b2o\$58bobobo12b2o3bo\$57b2obo14bo3bobo\$57bo2bo15bo3bobo\$58b2o17bo3bobob2o\$75bob4o2bob2o\$74bobo3bobo\$74bobo2bo2b2ob2o\$75bo3b2o2bobo\$83bobo10b2o\$84bo11b2o3\$98b2o11bo\$98b2o10bobo\$110bobo2b2o3bo\$109b2ob2o2bo2bobo\$113bobo3bobo\$109b2obo2b4obo\$109b2obobo3bo\$113bobo3bo\$114bobo3bo\$115bo3b2o\$134bo\$132b3o\$131bo9bo\$106b2o23b2o6b3o\$106b2o30bo\$91b2o45b2o\$90bo2bo48b2o\$89bob2o49bo\$89bo50bobo\$88b2o50b2o\$103b2o\$103bo\$104b3o\$106bo11b2o23bo\$119bo22bobo\$116b3o8b2o14bo\$116bo11bo\$125b3o\$125bo2\$71bo\$71b3o\$74bo\$73b2o15b2o\$90b2o40b2o28bo\$133bo26b3o\$118bo11b3o26bo\$116b3o11bo28b2o\$115bo\$115b2o\$121b2o44b2o\$80b2o39b2o7bo37bo\$79bo2bo45b3o37bob2o\$79bobo45bo32b2o4b3o2bo\$80bo46b2o31b2o3bo3b2o\$165b4o\$135b2o14b2o15bo\$135bo10b2o2bobo12b3o\$133bobo11bo2bo13bo\$133b2o10bo2b3o14b5o\$145b3o21bo\$148bo18bo\$147b2o18b2o\$162b2o\$162bo\$159b2obo\$158bo2bo\$159b2o\$144b2o\$111b2o31b2o\$111bo\$112b3o6b2o\$114bo2b2o2b2o\$114bobobo12b2o3bo\$95b3o15b2obo14bo3bobo\$95bo17bo2bo15bo3bobo\$96bo17b2o17bo3bobob2o\$131bob4o2bob2o\$130bobo3bobo\$130bobo2bo2b2ob2o\$131bo3b2o2bobo\$139bobo10b2o\$140bo11b2o3\$108bo\$107b2o\$107bobo![[ AUTOSTART STEP 8 ]]`

But no doubt substituting a G-to-2G for the initial G-to-G stage would produce something pretty close to that recovery time, maybe even still below 1000 ticks.

dvgrn
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### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

dvgrn wrote:Hmm, it's not too easy to actually get an output signal from it at that repeat rate, is it?

No, not so easy. This one works at 886 ticks but still no nice output.

`x = 102, y = 69, rule = B3/S2323b2o11bo\$23b2o10bobo\$35bobo2b2o3bo\$34b2ob2o2bo2bobo\$38bobo3bobo\$34b2obo2b4obo\$34b2obobo3bo\$38bobo3bo15b2o\$39bobo3bo14bo\$40bo3b2o12bobo\$54b2o2b2o\$54b2o2\$31b2o\$31b2o\$16b2o48b2o\$15bo2bo47b2o7b2o\$14bob2o57bo\$14bo58bobo\$13b2o58b2o\$28b2o\$28bo\$29b3o\$31bo10b2o\$41bobo\$41bo\$o39b2o23bo\$3o61bobob2o\$3bo44b2o12b3obobo\$2b2o15b2o28bo11bo3bo4bo21bo\$19b2o22bo2b3o13bo2bob4o19b3o\$43b4o7b2o7bobobo21bo\$54b2o8bo3b3o18b2o\$45b4o21bo\$44bo3bo\$44b2o51b2o\$50b2o46bo\$9b2o39b2o7bo38bob2o\$8bo2bo45b3o30b2o4b3o2bo\$8bobo45bo33b2o3bo3b2o\$9bo46b2o37b4o\$81b2o15bo\$64b2o14bobo12b3o\$64bo15bo13bo\$62bobo14b2o14b5o\$62b2o10bo24bo\$74b3o20bo\$77bo19b2o\$76b2o\$91b2o\$91bo\$88b2obo\$87bo2bo\$88b2o\$73b2o\$40b2o31b2o\$40bo\$41b3o6b2o\$43bo2b2o2b2o\$43bobobo12b2o3bo\$24b3o15b2obo14bo3bobo\$24bo17bo2bo15bo3bobo\$25bo17b2o17bo3bobob2o\$60bob4o2bob2o\$59bobo3bobo\$59bobo2bo2b2ob2o\$60bo3b2o2bobo\$68bobo10b2o\$69bo11b2o!`

EDIT: 951 ticks with glider output:

`x = 110, y = 117, rule = B3/S2350b2o\$50bobo\$52bo4b2o\$48b4ob2o2bo2bo\$48bo2bobobobob2o\$51bobobobo\$52b2obobo\$56bo2\$42b2o\$43bo7b2o\$43bobo5b2o\$44b2o7\$54b2o\$54bo\$55b3o\$57bo15\$90bo\$90b3o\$93bo\$92bobo\$92bobo\$93bo5\$108b2o\$7bo100b2o\$7b3o\$10bo\$o8b2o\$3o85b2o\$3bo83bobo\$2b2o15b2o66bo\$19b2o65b2o7b2o\$95b2o\$47bo\$45b3o55b2obo\$44bo58b2ob3o\$44b2o63bo\$50b2o51b2ob3o\$9b2o39b2o7bo42bo2b2o\$8bo2bo45b3o41bobo\$8bobo45bo26bo16bobob2obo\$9bo46b2o25b3o15bo2bob2o\$86bo17bo\$64b2o19b2o16b2o\$64bo16b2o17bobo2b2o\$62bobo16bo18b2o2bo2bo\$62b2o19bo21b2o\$82b2o6\$79b2o\$79b2o17b2o\$98b2o\$40b2o\$40bo\$41b3o6b2o47b2o\$43bo2b2o2b2o47bo\$43bobobo38b2o12b3o\$24b3o15b2obo41bo14bo\$24bo17bo2bo38b3o\$25bo17b2o39bo7\$91bo\$89b3o\$88bo\$88b2o7\$78b2o\$77bobo5b2o\$77bo7b2o\$76b2o2\$90bo\$86b2obobo\$85bobobobo\$82bo2bobobobob2o\$82b4ob2o2bo2bo\$86bo4b2o\$84bobo\$84b2o!`
Last edited by chris_c on March 28th, 2015, 2:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
chris_c

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### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

dvgrn wrote:
Extrementhusiast wrote:Well, here's one other way to get in, and it's Spartan, to boot...

Ah, much nicer. Will have to figure out how to add that to Spartan Hersrch at some point -- it would make a good compact delay conduit.

Except... haven't you just moved the problem back one step? Is there a Spartan way to deliver an R to that location? Even a Herschel receiver can't manage that trick. (?) (I may be behind the times again.)

So for the moment I'm looking at a full Herschel conduit along the lines of an Lx424:

`x = 81, y = 67, rule = B3/S2368b2o\$69bo\$69b3o6\$62b2o\$61bobo\$61bo\$60b2o2\$23b2o\$24bo14b2o\$24bobo12b2o9b2o\$25b2o23b2o2\$21b2o36b2o9b2o\$21bo37b2o9b2o\$22b3o\$24bo52bob2o\$77b2obo\$59b2o\$59b2o\$18b2o3b2o\$18bobobobo\$20bobo\$19b2ob2o\$75bo\$49b2o23bobo\$49b2o24b2o4\$14b2o\$13bo2bo2b2o\$13b3o2bobo\$16b2o\$13b2obo\$13bo2bo2bo\$14b3obobo57b2o\$18b2o58b2o\$16b2o\$17bo\$8bo8bobo29b2o\$8b3o7b2o29b2o\$11bo\$10b2o2\$75b2o\$75bo\$34b2o40b3o\$34b2o42bo2\$9bo\$9bobo\$9b3o\$11bo11b2o\$23bo\$24b3o\$26bo2\$2b2o\$3bo\$3o\$o!`

Definitely workable, but not so Spartan after all. Am I missing something?

I don't think so. So, let's find some seeds for the pair of bookends. Here are two:
`x = 51, y = 15, rule = B3/S234b2o\$4b2o6\$3obobo42bo\$4b2o38b2o2bo\$5bo33b3o2bobob3o\$45bo3\$4b2o36b2o\$4b2o36b2o!`
I Like My Heisenburps! (and others)

Extrementhusiast

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### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

By the way, since that article from 2009 says there are no known "perfect" highway robbers, has that changed in the last 6 years? Here's two baits that might be usable:
`#C [[ AUTOSTART GPS 20 LOOP 60 ]]x = 48, y = 12, rule = LifeHistory8.A6.2C3.C12.A6.2C3.2C\$8.2A4.C2.C.C.C11.2A4.C2.C2.C.C\$7.A.A5.2C3.2C10.A.A5.2C4.2C\$6.B.B22.B.B\$5.4B21.4B\$4.2C2B21.2C2B\$3.2B2C21.2B2C\$2.2BCB21.2BCB\$.A3B21.A3B\$B2AB21.B2AB\$ABA22.ABA\$.B24.B!`

(I love the fact that viewer settings can be put into [/code] blocks, and when showing them in the viewer, the settings will still be followed. It makes posts take up less vertical space, and I would assume it's less taxing on users on slow, low-end systems, too.)
Sphenocorona

Posts: 480
Joined: April 9th, 2013, 11:03 pm

### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

Sphenocorona wrote:By the way, since that article from 2009 says there are no known "perfect" highway robbers, has that changed in the last 6 years? Here's two baits that might be usable...

Yup, I have that same beehive+boat bait in my notes from 2004, but have made no progress on reconstructing that constellation cheaply.

There are two parts to perfection, incidentally: one is the initial "perfect robbery" part, where the bait collapses quickly off the highway so that no following glider sees any leftover sparks. The other is the "perfect cleanup", where the reconstructed bait still life does not impinge on the key glider lane until the circuit is completely ready to accept another glider.

I doubt that anything can be done about gliders that have already gone partway past the bait site. It would be very impressive if a highway robber could be designed that had no "forbidden zone" time period when gliders can not be allowed on the key lane. It's not completely absolutely impossible, but a baker's dozen different reactions and output signals and recovery modes might be needed, so I think the resulting object would be so horrendously slow as to not be all that interesting.

But it could be possible for a bait still-life construction to push a cell into the glider lane very late, just as it's stabilizing, going from its out-of-the-way state to its ready-to-rob state in just one tick. Don't know if that's too likely for the beehive+boat bait, though.

dvgrn
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### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

Scorbie and A for awesome posted a couple of functional pre-honeyfarm-to-glider converters over on the Useless Discoveries thread, that I'm transferring over here because I'm not quite sure that they're really useless.

Clearance is definitely fairly limited for getting the pre-honeyfarm in... but I figure if I can really easily design an engineered way to do the insertion, then probably there are plenty of natural reactions out there somewhere, that throw a pre-honeyfarm the same distance:

`x = 155, y = 52, rule = LifeHistory15.A99.A\$13.3A97.3A\$12.A99.A\$12.2A85.2A11.2A\$98.A2.A\$9.3D86.A.2A7.3D\$8.D3.D82.2A.A9.D3.D\$7.D5.D81.2A.A8.D5.D\$7.D5.D84.2A7.D5.D\$7.D5.D25.6A53.A2.A5.D5.D25.6A\$2.2A4.D3.D26.A5.A53.2A.A5.D3.D26.A5.A\$.A.A5.3D27.A61.A7.3D27.A\$.A38.A57.A.A39.A\$2A96.2A2\$3.2A\$3.2A2\$109.2A\$109.2A2\$5.A.2A13.A99.A\$3.3A.2A12.2A98.2A\$2.A18.A.A97.A.A\$3.3A.2A7.2A\$5.A.A9.A\$5.A.A8.A\$6.A9.2A7\$36.A99.A\$35.2A98.2A\$35.A.A97.A.A13\$53.A99.A\$52.2A98.2A\$52.A.A97.A.A!`

[I didn't try to find a similar trick for simeks' third HF-to-2G, because that one really does seem closed-in enough to be unusable in practice.]

It would be nice to find a compatible H-to-HF or two, to make this into a legitimate elementary conduit to add to the collection.

dvgrn
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### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

Seems useless, but hoping if somebody could get something out.
`x = 11, y = 18, rule = LifeHistory2A\$.A7.2A\$.A.A5.2A\$2.2A12\$7.A\$6.3A\$5.2A.A!`
Best wishes to you, Scorbie

Scorbie

Posts: 1381
Joined: December 7th, 2013, 1:05 am

### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

A rather hollow Rx262:
`x = 70, y = 42, rule = LifeHistory16.2A\$17.A\$17.A.A23.2A\$18.2A23.A\$41.A.A\$41.2A4\$7.A\$7.3A\$10.A58.D\$9.2A56.3D\$50.2A15.D.D\$50.2A15.D\$2A\$2A4\$47.2A\$33.2A12.A\$33.2A13.3A\$50.A9\$15.2A\$15.2A2\$15.A\$14.3A\$14.3A2\$13.4A\$13.5A\$14.A.2A!`
I Like My Heisenburps! (and others)

Extrementhusiast

Posts: 1794
Joined: June 16th, 2009, 11:24 pm
Location: USA

### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

Extrementhusiast wrote:A rather hollow Rx262...

Wow! A new Spartan dependent conduit, joining F166 and Lx200, and it turns in a new direction -- and repeat time isn't too bad, either (145 ticks).

Seems like it's definitely time to collect recent discoveries into a new build of Hersrch. Quite possibly there will be new Spartan searches to do to synchronize N gliders to run a minimal invariant turner, if nothing else.

dvgrn
Moderator

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### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

An H-to-3G:
`x = 23, y = 25, rule = LifeHistory9.2A\$9.2A2\$21.2A\$2A19.2A\$2A15\$4.3C\$5.C8.2A\$5.3C6.A\$15.3A\$17.A!`

A similar H-to-R-loaf:
`x = 29, y = 34, rule = LifeHistory7.2A\$6.A.A\$6.2A\$23.A\$21.3A\$20.A\$20.2A7\$2A\$2A2\$26.2D\$25.D2.D\$26.D.D\$27.2D10\$4.3C\$5.C8.2A\$5.3C6.A\$15.3A\$17.A!`

The known converters don't work, but it seems that others might. Interestingly, removing the eater gives a very nice H-to-block:
`x = 42, y = 32, rule = LifeHistory7.2A\$6.A.A\$6.2A\$23.A\$21.3A\$20.A\$20.2A7\$2A\$2A38.2D\$40.2D14\$4.3C\$5.C\$5.3C!`
I Like My Heisenburps! (and others)

Extrementhusiast

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Location: USA

### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

Extrementhusiast wrote:An H-to-3G:

Here is an even simpler one:
`x = 25, y = 25, rule = B3/S2323b2o\$23bo\$21bobo\$21b2o4\$2o\$2o2\$22bo\$20bobo\$20b3o\$20bo8\$12b2o\$12bo\$13b3o\$15bo!`

simsim314

Posts: 1702
Joined: February 10th, 2014, 1:27 pm

### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

I was playing with CatForce, and reported all pairs of successful catalysts (no pairs in CatForce directly). Here are some interesting stuff I found (some of it is probably known):

`x = 1403, y = 37, rule = B3/S231387bo\$10bo1375bobo\$8b2o427bo82bo865bobo\$7b2o426b3o80b3o100bo765bo\$6bo427bo82bo101b3o85b2o\$7b5o262bo159b2o81b2o99bo88bo\$8bo93bo169b3o343b2o85bobo\$100b2o69bo99bo92bo340b2o431bo137b2o\$99b2o69bobo22bo75b2o89b3o772bobo136b2o\$98bo72bo21b2o166bo776bo\$3bo95b5o88b2o167b2o\$2bobo76b2o17bo90bo\$3bo77b2o109b5o680b2o\$193bo254bo82bo177bo167bo178b2o\$276bo169b2o81b2o176b2o166bobo178bo\$274b2o169b2o81b2o102bo73b2o167b2o177bobo\$2o81b2o188b2o91bo77bo82bo102b2o73bo348b2o\$obo79bobo187bo91b2o79b5o78b5o96b2o75b5o65b2o287bo\$2bo79bo190b5o85b2o81bo82bo98bo78bo68bo286b3o\$2b2o77b2o191bo87bo251b2o13b5o140bobo285bo\$182b2o179b5o247bo14bo143b2o286b2o100bo\$182bo181bo247b3o236b2o26bo282b2o237bo\$183b3o72b2o93b2o257bo238b2o24b2o89b2o191b2o129bo106b2o\$185bo73bo93bo522b2o75b2o13bo191bo129b2o106b2o\$256b3o95b3o161b2o355bo77b2o11bobo192b5o123b2o106bo\$256bo99bo161bo357b5o85b2o194bo125bo109b5o\$519b3o171b2o83bo98bo189bo221b5o105bo\$430b2o89bo171b2o81b2o287b2o223bo\$431bo343b2o287b2o208b2o\$428b3o343bo288bo211bo\$428bo346b5o284b5o203b3o108b2o\$757b2o17bo193bo94bo91b2o113bo111bo\$757b2o209b2o187b2o222b3o\$967b2o412bo\$966bo\$967b5o\$968bo!`

simsim314

Posts: 1702
Joined: February 10th, 2014, 1:27 pm

### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

simsim314 wrote:I was playing with CatForce, and reported all pairs of successful catalysts (no pairs in CatForce directly). Here are some interesting stuff I found (some of it is probably known)...

Yup, I recognize the majority of these. Some of the ones that I don't recognize have probably been investigated, too, but it never hurts to re-run a search (maybe with some new catalysts like the ship+eater) if someone has the time for it.

Here are the ones that are likely to lead to rediscoveries:

• #1: same output as Lx134
• #2: see HtoG#24 (SE lane 15)
• #4: same initial catalysts as F171
• #5: B94 on top of input H, has been looked at before, not too likely to be useful
• #7: same output as Fx78 (so same initial catalysts as F117)
• #9: same output as Lx134
• #A: see HtoG#25 (SE lane 18)
• #E: block in same location as Fx176 / H-to-pi converter
• #F: transparent beehive in same location as HtoG#3 (SE lane -3), and both catalysts in same locations as in HtoG#12 (NW lane 9)
Code: Select all
`x = 629, y = 197, rule = LifeHistory7.9D85.4D85.8D75.9D83.8D68.19D63.9D68.22D\$5.13D79.8D83.13D69.14D81.8D68.19D60.13D67.22D\$4.15D74.12D81.16D66.18D78.9D68.19D59.15D66.22D\$3.17D71.14D80.18D64.20D77.9D68.19D57.17D66.22D\$3.7D3.7D70.15D79.8D4.8D63.8D5.7D76.10D68.6D69.10D3.4D67.6D10.6D\$2.7D5.7D69.15D79.7D7.6D63.6D8.7D74.11D68.6D68.8D77.6D9.7D\$2.6D7.6D70.6D.7D78.7D8.7D63.4D10.6D74.11D68.6D67.8D79.4D10.7D\$.7D7.7D76.7D78.7D9.6D77.6D73.12D68.6D67.7D94.6D\$.6D9.6D76.7D78.6D10.6D77.6D73.12D68.6D66.7D94.7D\$.6D9.6D76.7D78.6D10.6D77.6D72.13D68.6D65.7D95.7D\$7D9.7D75.7D79.4D10.7D76.7D72.6D.6D68.15D56.7D95.6D\$7D9.7D75.7D93.7D75.7D72.7D.6D68.17D54.6D2.7D86.7D\$6D10.7D75.7D92.8D69.13D71.7D2.6D68.18D53.17D84.7D\$6D10.7D75.7D91.8D69.13D72.7D2.6D68.19D51.20D82.6D\$6D10.7D75.7D90.9D69.13D71.7D3.6D68.9D3.8D50.21D80.7D\$6D10.7D75.7D89.9D71.13D70.6D4.6D68.7D6.7D50.12D2.7D80.7D\$6D10.7D75.7D88.9D77.9D68.7D4.6D69.4D9.7D49.10D5.7D79.6D\$6D10.7D75.7D87.9D80.7D68.6D5.6D83.6D49.9D7.6D78.7D\$7D9.7D75.7D86.9D82.7D66.7D5.6D83.6D50.8D7.7D77.7D\$7D9.7D75.7D84.10D83.7D66.6D6.6D83.6D50.7D8.7D77.6D\$7D9.6D76.7D83.9D86.6D65.22D80.6D50.6D10.6D76.7D\$.6D9.6D76.7D82.9D87.6D65.22D80.6D50.7D9.6D76.6D\$.7D7.7D76.7D81.9D88.6D65.22D80.6D50.7D8.7D76.6D\$2.6D7.6D77.7D80.9D89.6D65.22D79.7D51.6D8.7D75.7D\$2.7D5.7D77.7D79.9D73.5D11.7D78.6D66.5D11.7D51.7D6.7D76.6D\$3.7D3.7D78.7D77.9D9.4D62.6D8.8D79.6D65.8D7.8D53.7D4.8D76.6D\$3.17D71.21D70.23D60.22D76.13D62.22D54.18D76.7D\$4.15D71.23D69.23D61.20D76.14D63.20D56.16D77.6D\$5.13D72.23D69.23D62.18D77.14D65.17D59.13D78.6D\$7.9D75.21D70.23D65.12D81.13D68.11D64.9D81.4D11\$14.BD\$12.A2D2B425.C82.C\$10.ABCD3B423.3C80.3C80.C\$9.BACA.2B423.C82.C81.3C\$10.AB5D262.C159.2C81.2C79.C\$12.BD3B89.BD169.3C323.2C\$104.A2D2B67.C99.C92.C\$102.ABCD3B66.C.C21.BD75.2C89.3C\$101.BACA.2B68.C20.A2D2B164.C\$8.C93.AB5D86.ABCD3B164.2C\$7.C.C76.2C16.BD3B85.BACA.2B\$8.C77.2C107.AB5D\$197.BD3B250.BD81.BD\$280.BD168.A2D2B78.A2D2B\$278.A2D2B165.ABCD3B76.ABCD3B78.BD\$5.2C81.2C186.ABCD3B87.BD75.BACA.2B76.BACA.2B77.A2D2B\$5.C.C79.C.C185.BACA.2B86.A2D2B75.AB5D76.AB5D74.ABCD3B\$7.C79.C188.AB5D83.ABCD3B77.BD3B78.BD3B73.BACA.2B\$7.2C77.2C190.BD3B82.BACA.2B227.2C11.AB5D\$187.2C177.AB5D227.C13.BD3B\$187.C180.BD3B224.3C\$188.3C72.2C93.2C237.C\$190.C73.C93.C\$261.3C95.3C161.2C\$261.C99.C161.C\$524.3C\$435.2C89.C\$436.C\$433.3C\$433.C25\$629F27\$8.9D81.8D\$6.13D77.12D250.9D3.4D\$4.16D74.15D64.14D73.19D77.19D60.17D60.25D64.27D\$3.18D73.16D62.16D71.23D72.21D59.21D56.26D64.27D\$3.8D3.8D71.7D3.8D61.16D71.24D70.22D59.22D55.26D64.27D\$2.7D7.7D69.7D6.7D61.15D72.24D68.9D4.10D60.22D55.25D64.27D\$2.6D8.7D69.6D7.7D66.11D74.6D8.7D67.8D9.7D62.6D7.8D57.6D10.6D68.6D11.6D\$2.6D9.6D69.6D8.7D65.11D74.6D9.7D66.7D11.6D62.6D9.7D56.6D10.6D68.6D11.6D\$2.6D9.6D68.7D8.7D64.13D73.6D10.6D65.7D12.6D62.6D10.6D56.6D10.6D68.6D11.6D\$2.6D9.6D68.7D9.6D64.13D73.6D10.6D65.6D13.6D62.6D10.7D55.6D10.6D68.6D11.6D\$2.6D8.7D68.7D9.6D63.7D.7D72.6D10.6D64.7D14.4D63.6D11.6D55.6D10.6D68.6D11.6D\$2.7D7.7D68.7D8.8D62.7D.7D72.6D9.7D64.6D82.6D11.7D54.6D4.4D3.4D69.6D4.4D4.4D\$3.8D3.8D70.6D8.8D62.6D3.6D72.6D9.7D64.6D82.6D12.6D54.6D3.6D75.6D3.6D\$3.18D71.7D6.9D61.7D3.7D71.6D7.8D65.6D82.6D12.6D54.6D3.6D75.6D3.6D\$4.17D71.7D5.10D61.6D5.6D71.21D65.6D82.6D12.6D54.15D75.15D\$4.17D72.8D2.11D60.7D5.7D70.20D66.6D82.6D12.6D54.15D75.15D\$3.19D72.20D60.7D5.7D70.21D65.6D82.6D12.6D54.15D75.15D\$2.9D3.9D72.19D60.6D7.6D70.22D64.6D82.6D12.6D54.15D75.15D\$2.7D7.7D73.18D59.21D69.6D8.9D63.6D82.6D12.6D54.6D3.6D75.6D3.6D\$.7D9.6D75.7D2.6D60.21D69.6D10.8D62.6D82.6D12.6D54.6D3.6D75.6D3.6D\$.7D9.7D82.7D59.23D68.6D11.7D62.7D81.6D12.6D54.6D4.4D4.4D68.6D4.4D\$.7D9.7D82.7D59.23D68.6D12.6D62.7D81.6D11.7D54.6D11.6D67.6D\$.7D9.7D81.7D59.7D11.7D67.6D12.6D63.7D14.4D62.6D11.6D55.6D11.6D67.6D\$.7D9.7D80.7D60.7D11.7D67.6D12.6D63.8D12.6D61.6D10.7D55.6D11.6D67.6D\$2.7D7.7D79.9D60.6D13.6D67.6D12.6D64.8D10.7D61.6D9.7D56.6D11.6D67.6D\$2.8D5.8D69.5D3.10D60.7D13.7D66.6D10.8D65.9D6.9D61.6D7.9D56.6D11.6D67.6D\$3.19D70.17D60.11D6.14D60.26D67.22D60.23D54.26D63.18D\$4.17D70.16D62.12D5.14D59.27D68.20D60.23D54.27D63.18D\$5.15D72.13D64.12D5.14D59.25D72.16D62.21D56.27D63.18D\$8.9D77.9D66.11D6.14D60.22D77.10D66.18D59.26D63.18D10\$602.C\$601.C.C\$601.C.C\$602.C\$14.2C\$14.C\$12.C.C\$12.2C409.C87.2C\$422.C.C86.2C\$423.C3\$184.2C\$15.BD167.C178.2C\$13.A2D2B164.C.C178.C\$11.ABCD3B164.2C177.C.C\$10.BACA.2B344.2C\$11.AB5D85.2C267.C\$13.BD3B85.C266.3C\$101.C.C265.C\$101.2C266.2C77.BD\$158.2C25.BD259.A2D2B164.BD\$158.2C23.A2D2B87.2C167.ABCD3B75.BD85.A2D2B\$181.ABCD3B72.2C13.C167.BACA.2B74.A2D2B82.ABCD3B\$180.BACA.2B73.2C11.C.C168.AB5D71.ABCD3B81.BACA.2B\$181.AB5D85.2C171.BD3B70.BACA.2B83.AB5D\$2C102.BD77.BD3B185.BD147.AB5D84.BD3B\$2C100.A2D2B264.A2D2B148.BD3B\$100.ABCD3B262.ABCD3B133.2C\$99.BACA.2B262.BACA.2B135.C\$100.AB5D262.AB5D131.3C88.2C\$84.2C16.BD3B169.BD93.BD3B66.2C63.C91.C\$84.2C188.A2D2B163.2C152.3C\$272.ABCD3B317.C\$271.BACA.2B\$272.AB5D\$274.BD3B!#C [[ VIEWONLY ZOOM 1 HEIGHT 240 ]]`

Of the remaining ones... #B looks as if it might possibly lead to a nice R213, and #D just looks interesting. Don't know about the likelihood of reaching back and killing the #D leftover blinker in a reasonable amount of time.

Probably better to try running further searches on #3, #6, #8, or #C first -- something new might turn up for those. The rest have definitely already had successful searches run on them, which means that a lot of other options have already been tried and discarded there.

Of course it's always possible that any of the new Bellman catalysts will be the key to a new Herschel conduit with an old beginning. It just seems likely that the duplication rate will be a little higher in those search spaces, and the success rate a little lower.

dvgrn
Moderator

Posts: 5830
Joined: May 17th, 2009, 11:00 pm

### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

List of most potential catalysts I've found in here

`x = 629, y = 136, rule = LifeHistory611.2C\$610.C.C\$497.2C112.C\$496.C.C\$497.C\$5.2C\$4.C.C\$5.C\$179.C9.C415.C\$179.3C5.3C414.C.C\$182.C3.C194.2C222.C\$181.2C3.2C193.2C242.2C\$276.C348.C\$274.3C234.2C110.C.C\$273.C237.C111.2C\$72.2C199.2C234.C.C\$19.2C51.2C20.C169.2C129.2C112.2C\$19.C72.2C169.C2.C128.C\$17.C.C71.2C171.2C127.C.C\$17.2C71.C302.2C\$73.2C16.5C531.C\$73.2C17.C532.2C\$513.C110.2C\$511.2C110.C\$74.2C434.2C112.5C\$21.C51.C.C124.C86.C109.C111.C96.2C17.C\$19.2C52.C124.2C85.2C108.2C113.5C91.2C\$18.2C52.2C7.2C114.2C85.2C108.2C115.C\$17.C63.C114.C86.C109.C\$18.5C59.3C112.5C82.5C105.5C\$19.C64.C113.C86.C109.C212.2C\$379.2C226.C.C\$380.C226.C\$377.3C226.2C\$14.C265.C96.C122.2C\$13.C.C176.2C85.C.C218.C\$14.C177.2C86.C220.3C\$2C177.2C322.C\$2C177.2C2\$11.2C\$11.C.C\$13.C\$13.2C68\$55.2C\$55.C\$53.C.C\$53.2C2\$37.2D22.2C\$36.D2.2D20.C\$35.D3.2D18.C.C\$36.D2.2D18.2C\$37.2D6\$60.C\$58.C.C\$58.3C\$58.C2\$44.2C\$43.C.C4.2C\$43.C6.C\$42.2C7.3C\$53.C!`

@dvgrn Thx for the comprehensive feedback. I hope to run the searches on what you mention as the most potential soon. Meanwhile I'm developing CatForce further.

I'm thinking also making some "bellman light" version for CatForce.

I think the idea of combining "local" catalysts from single step search together, into - one giant search output, and define it as single iteration is the key. Using categories and prioritization, we can get a lot of new "good stuff" from this approach.

simsim314

Posts: 1702
Joined: February 10th, 2014, 1:27 pm

### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

Extrementhusiast wrote:Interestingly, removing the eater gives a very nice H-to-block...

Or adding a block catalyst removes the final block, producing another alternate H-to-3G.

It looks like this block inserter could maybe be used as a one-time replacement for the eater2 in a syringe. I haven't tried setting it up to see if it will work, because it seems as if the resulting Spartan structure will be too slow and cumbersome to be useful.

I think it's time now for somebody (probably me) to write a quick script that, assuming that the selection is a clean H-to-nG converter, normalizes and runs it and reports the exact glider lanes and timings for each output glider. Output will look something like

`Dir   Lane  T      XSW    -2    14     1NW     9    47    -3NW    23    68     15`

To make this work, there will be a canonical phase for each direction of output glider, and the X value will report the location where that phase first occurs. (I'll probably report the Y value too, though that can also be calculated from the lane number.)

Probably the program should keep, and add to, a database of H-to-Gs and the various gliders' measurements, so we can easily tell if an H-to-G is really a new one or merely a variant of something previously known.

dvgrn
Moderator

Posts: 5830
Joined: May 17th, 2009, 11:00 pm

### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

Here is a conduit (F271?) based on one of the previous findings:

`x = 47, y = 64, rule = LifeHistory35.2C3.2C\$35.2C3.2C8\$43.2C\$28.2C13.2C\$28.2C9\$44.2C\$44.2C8\$8.2C\$7.C.C\$8.C3\$43.2C\$43.C\$33.2C3.2C4.3C\$2.C28.C2.C4.C6.C\$.C.C27.3C5.C.C\$2.C37.2C\$22.2C7.3C\$22.C8.C2.C\$20.C.C10.2C\$20.2C6\$2C\$2C19.C\$19.C.C\$19.3C\$19.C\$3.2C\$3.2C4\$5.2C\$4.C.C4.2C\$4.C6.C\$3.2C7.3C\$14.C!`

simsim314

Posts: 1702
Joined: February 10th, 2014, 1:27 pm

### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

One of the eaters can be replaced by a snake:
`x = 47, y = 64, rule = LifeHistory35.2C3.2C\$35.2C3.2C8\$43.2C\$28.2C13.2C\$28.2C9\$44.2C\$44.2C8\$8.2C\$7.C.C\$8.C3\$43.2C\$43.C\$33.2C3.2C4.3C\$2.C28.C2.C4.C6.C\$.C.C27.3C4.C\$2.C35.2C\$22.2C7.3C\$22.C8.C2.C\$20.C.C10.2C\$20.2C6\$2C\$2C19.C\$19.C.C\$19.3C\$19.C\$3.2C\$3.2C4\$5.2C\$4.C.C4.2C\$4.C6.C\$3.2C7.3C\$14.C![[ THEME 7 ZOOM 4 ]]`

gameoflifeboy

Posts: 474
Joined: January 15th, 2015, 2:08 am

### Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits

simsim314 wrote:Here is a conduit (F271?) based on one of the previous findings...

That's a nice first result -- congratulations! Apparently nobody ever figured out how to extract a sideways B-heptomino from the old Lx134 reaction, instead of cleaning up the R and waiting for the Herschel.

It's getting hard to remember all these different varieties of "self-cleaning" composite circuits -- this one is a H-to-B-to-R-to-H, absorbing three internal gliders along the way, so the repeat rate is very slow as usual (286 ticks). It can follow quite a few conduits -- e.g., F117, Fx153, R190, and F171 with a little welding. Does anyone see a way to let the F171's extra glider escape?

`x = 52, y = 82, rule = B3/S2314bo\$13bobo\$13bobo\$14bo\$25bo\$25bo\$23b3o9b2o3b2o\$23bo11b2o3b2o8\$43b2o\$28b2o13b2o\$28b2o9\$44b2o\$44b2o8\$8b2o\$7bobo\$8bo3\$43b2o\$43bo\$33b2o3b2o4b3o\$2bo28bo2bo4bo6bo\$bobo27b3o5bobo\$2bo37bobo\$22b2o7b3o8bo\$22bo8bo2bo6bob2o\$20bobo10b2o4b3obobo\$20b2o16bo5bo\$38b2o\$46bo\$44b3o\$43bo\$43b2o\$2o\$2o\$46b2o\$46bo\$44bobo\$3b2o39b2o\$3b2o2\$51bo\$49b3o\$48bo\$48b2o\$12b2o\$12bo\$13b3o\$15bo3\$50bo\$48bobo\$48b3o\$48bo2\$40b2o\$40bo\$41b3o\$43bo!`

A really nice feature is that the minimal Lx134 catalysis works just fine, removing the protruding eater. That just happens to make Fx119+F271 into a rare near-Spartan Edge Shooter In Passing (it doesn't use up the Herschel). There might be some interesting pseudo-period guns that use that combination of circuits to get two or more timed gliders on an output lane -- or maybe just generate multiple gliders to trigger and reset a chain of semi-Snarks.

`x = 73, y = 83, rule = B3/S2336bo\$35bobo\$35bobo\$36bo\$47bo\$47bo\$45b3o9b2o3b2o\$45bo11b2o3b2o8\$65b2o\$50b2o13b2o\$50b2o9\$66b2o\$66b2o8\$30b2o\$29bobo\$30bo3\$65b2o\$65bo\$2bo52b2o3b2o4b3o\$obo21bo28bo2bo4bo6bo\$b2o20bobo27b3o5bobo\$24bo37b2o\$44b2o7b3o\$44bo8bo2bo\$42bobo10b2o\$42b2o2\$62bo\$53b2o5b3o\$53b2o4bo\$59b2o\$22b2o\$22b2o\$58b2o\$53b2o3b2o\$53b2o\$25b2o\$25b2o3\$63b2o6b2o\$63bo7bo\$61bobo5bobo\$34b2o25b2o6b2o\$34bo\$35b3o\$37bo\$61bo\$61b3o\$61bobo\$63bo2\$35bo\$36b2o\$35b2o\$64b2o\$64bo\$65b3o\$67bo!`

So now we have similar motivation as for the eater2 case, to find half a dozen edge-of-envelope recipes for the other orientation of bookends (we have this one from chris_c, which is pretty good -- can probably just add a boat to build it from a different direction).

dvgrn
Moderator

Posts: 5830
Joined: May 17th, 2009, 11:00 pm