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Re: Suggested LifeWiki edits

Postby dvgrn » February 25th, 2019, 10:43 pm

Moosey wrote:Also, the lifewiki article for the tumbler... needs to be fixed, but I wouldn’t know the 6G synth off the top of my head.

Fixed now. The 6-glider synthesis isn't exactly hard to find. The footnote you quoted points to the posting directly above it.

For the camelship, go ahead and make a page for it!
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Re: Suggested LifeWiki edits

Postby Moosey » March 26th, 2019, 1:07 pm

Similarly:
#C stolen from Catagolue
x = 42, y = 43, rule = B3/S23
4bobo$5b2o$5bo4$9bo$7bobo$8b2o3$11bo$9bobo$10b2o5$o13bo20b2o$b2o11bobo
17bo2bo$2o12b2o17bob2obo$34bo2bo$35b2o18$39b3o$39bo$40bo!

How do I get this to the wiki?
After searching the wiki for a RLE:honeycomb_synth under the everything (I.e. capable of searching user, RLE, etc. Namespaces) , I found no helpful page.
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Re: Suggested LifeWiki edits

Postby dvgrn » March 26th, 2019, 3:06 pm

Moosey wrote:Similarly:
#C stolen from Catagolue
x = 42, y = 43, rule = B3/S23
4bobo$5b2o$5bo4$9bo$7bobo$8b2o3$11bo$9bobo$10b2o5$o13bo20b2o$b2o11bobo
17bo2bo$2o12b2o17bob2obo$34bo2bo$35b2o18$39b3o$39bo$40bo!

How do I get this to the wiki?
After searching the wiki for a RLE:honeycomb_synth under the everything (I.e. capable of searching user, RLE, etc. Namespaces) , I found no helpful page.

The general idea would be to go ahead and create the RLE:honeycomb_synth page, and add text like this to it:

#C 6-glider synthesis of honeycomb
x = 42, y = 43, rule = B3/S23
4bobo$5b2o$5bo4$9bo$7bobo$8b2o3$11bo$9bobo$10b2o5$o13bo20b2o$b2o11bobo
17bo2bo$2o12b2o17bob2obo$34bo2bo$35b2o18$39b3o$39bo$40bo!

This is a weird case, as you've discovered, because an outdated pattern file was already uploaded to the server, and only moderators and admins can go in and manually delete files off the server. I've done that now. That means that a newly created RLE:honeycomb_synth will now be picked up by the auto-upload script. The script will automatically generate the #N honeycomb_synth.rle and #C http://conwaylife.com/wiki/Honeycomb lines.

... Just FYI for anyone else reading this who wants to know how this stuff works: the old file looked like this --

#N honeycomb_synth.rle
#O Chris Cain, 24 November 2014
#C 9-glider synthesis of honeycomb
#C http://conwaylife.com/wiki/Honeycomb
#C http://conwaylife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=14496#p14496
x = 44, y = 34, rule = B3/S23
26bo$26bobo$26b2o5$24bo$24bobo$24b2o$17bobo$17b2o$18bo2$2bo6bo30b2o$ob
o4bobo29bo2bo$b2o5b2o28bob2obo$16bo22bo2bo$14b2o24b2o$15b2o2$27b2o$27b
obo$27bo7$21b2o$7b2o12bobo$8b2o11bo$7bo!

The auto-upload script is very conservative, so it never automatically overwrites an already uploaded pattern file with anything it finds in the RLE namespace.

Maybe A Report Will Help
Eventually I'm planning to add a reporting feature to the auto-upload script so that it makes a folder showing RLE-namespace patterns vs. LifeWiki server patterns for any cases where there are patterns in both places and they don't match.

It might be a good while before that happens, though, because I'm not sure I really want to fight all the way through a report like that and fix everything that shows up.

Here's What I Think About Uploading Syntheses, But This Is Just Me
As mentioned elsewhere, neither Catagolue's nor Mark Niemiec's or Heinrich Koenig's current synthesis databases are up to date at the moment. We really need a single "source of truth" database that anyone can update, but we don't have that yet. Until the new edition of Mark's database becomes available, I'm hoping nobody will start any Grand Projects of adding lots of new RLE:{pname}_synth files by just copying blindly from Catagolue or anywhere else.

It seems fine to add any synthesis that you're sure is the latest greatest up-to-datest -- if enough people do that, then the LifeWiki will eventually become our "source of truth" database. It's just not such a good idea to copy syntheses en masse from any existing database; that's potentially a huge waste of time (in my opinion, anyway) because it will add lots of syntheses that just have to be deleted again.

Forlorn Hopes For Future Vaporware
Really I hope that we eventually won't have to upload any _synth files at all. Ideally the LifeWiki should just link directly to a hypothetical separate "source of truth" glider synthesis database -- preferably one that accepts crowdsourced contributions of new syntheses, checks to make sure they're valid, and immediately makes them available.

The closest thing we have to that right now is the RLE namespace. Theoretically a script could be written to check new RLE:{pname}_synth files, and immediately complain about any that aren't new records, or that don't actually construct the object they promise to construct. But to do that we'd need to have a way to mark a single synthesis as the record holder. Current _synth files often include lots of different ways of building something, or they include both an incremental and a continuous synthesis, or they're in Mark Niemiec's multistate format instead of plain RLE, or they're only uploaded to the server and not available in the RLE namespace at all... etc., etc.
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Re: Suggested LifeWiki edits

Postby fluffykitty » April 17th, 2019, 2:52 pm

The super loaf page implies that the super mango contains an inverted mango, but the super mango page contradicts that.
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Re: Suggested LifeWiki edits

Postby Ian07 » April 17th, 2019, 3:29 pm

fluffykitty wrote:The super loaf page implies that the super mango contains an inverted mango, but the super mango page contradicts that.

Fixed.

Speaking of contradictions, the sole paragraph on the R2D2 page seems to imply that the stator variant in the infobox (right) was the original version found in the 1970s. Meanwhile, there's an image caption with a different stator (left) claiming that was the original version. I wasn't able to find any external sources indicating which of these is correct:

x = 25, y = 11, rule = B3/S23
3b2o$3b2o14bo$18bobo$b6o10bobobo$o6bo9bobobo$2o3b3o6b2obo3bob2o$14b2ob
o3bob2o$8o9bo3bo$o6bo9bobobo$3b2o13bobo$3b2o14bo!
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Re: Suggested LifeWiki edits

Postby Moosey » April 17th, 2019, 3:34 pm

Ian07 wrote:Speaking of contradictions, the sole paragraph on the R2D2 page seems to imply that the stator variant in the infobox (right) was the original version found in the 1970s. Meanwhile, there's an image caption with a different stator (left) claiming that was the original version. I wasn't able to find any external sources indicating which of these is correct:

x = 25, y = 11, rule = B3/S23
3b2o$3b2o14bo$18bobo$b6o10bobobo$o6bo9bobobo$2o3b3o6b2obo3bob2o$14b2ob
o3bob2o$8o9bo3bo$o6bo9bobobo$3b2o13bobo$3b2o14bo!

I’d imagine the original form is the larger one one the left— it looks more like R2-D2.

Assuming they named it after the Star Wars character.
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Re: Suggested LifeWiki edits

Postby Ian07 » April 17th, 2019, 3:49 pm

Moosey wrote:I’d imagine the original form is the larger one one the left— it looks more like R2-D2.

Assuming they named it after the Star Wars character.

I agree that it looks more like R2-D2, but I should note the name was actually for Elkies' 1994 variant. (in fact, Star Wars didn't even exist until a few years after the original stator was found)
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Re: Suggested LifeWiki edits

Postby dvgrn » April 17th, 2019, 3:50 pm

Moosey wrote:I’d imagine the original form is the larger one one the left— it looks more like R2-D2.

Assuming they named it after the Star Wars character.

Yes, well, you're right, and yet it's all backwards anyway.

Peter Raynam found the R2-D2 rotor in the early '70s, but didn't name it. Noam Elkies came along in '94, rediscovered the rotor, put a different stator on it, and then called that version "R2-D2", before finding out it was a rediscovery. So now the original version is called "R2-D2", too.

I've edited the wiki article, hopefully without making it any more confusing than it was before.
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Re: Suggested LifeWiki edits

Postby fluffykitty » May 11th, 2019, 1:29 pm

The Caterpillar page states that it's the largest interesting pattern in CGoL by population, but that may no longer be true due to the existence of the 0E0P metacell.
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Re: Suggested LifeWiki edits

Postby Ian07 » May 11th, 2019, 2:02 pm

fluffykitty wrote:The Caterpillar page states that it's the largest interesting pattern in CGoL by population, but that may no longer be true due to the existence of the 0E0P metacell.

I've refactored this to "Caterpillar was, in terms of its minimum 11,880,063 alive cells, one of the largest patterns constructed in Life up to that point." It's worth noting that the "largest interesting pattern" is entirely subjective; depending on what you consider interesting this title could go to something like the Quest for Tetris computer, with a minimum population of ~26 billion though which could probably be reduced by several orders of magnitude.

EDIT: That reminds me, could someone please look over the Caterloopillar page for me? There seems to be quite a few grammatical errors in there.
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Re: Suggested LifeWiki edits

Postby calcyman » May 11th, 2019, 5:48 pm

Ian07 wrote:I've refactored this to "Caterpillar was, in terms of its minimum 11,880,063 alive cells, one of the largest patterns constructed in Life up to that point." It's worth noting that the "largest interesting pattern" is entirely subjective; depending on what you consider interesting this title could go to something like the Quest for Tetris computer, with a minimum population of ~26 billion though which could probably be reduced by several orders of magnitude.


The QFT computer is difficult to reason about: even though it's population is large, it has a .mc.gz file size of 121 KB so there's not too much irreducible complexity in there.

How do we measure irreducible complexity, anyway? Kolmogorov's definition is the most elegant, but sadly it's uncomputable, so it's not the easiest measure to use in practice. Is the .mc.gz file size a good enough proxy?
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Re: Suggested LifeWiki edits

Postby fluffykitty » May 11th, 2019, 9:49 pm

Something like a Sierpinski's carpet (fractal to be very simple to generate programmatically, but with expansion factor not a power of 2 so macrocell compression is ineffective) is very different between the two definitions
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Re: Suggested LifeWiki edits

Postby fluffykitty » May 15th, 2019, 1:05 pm

http://www.conwaylife.com/wiki/Centipede_caterloopillar has an RLE link in the "see also" section.
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Re: Suggested LifeWiki edits

Postby Ian07 » May 15th, 2019, 9:33 pm

fluffykitty wrote:http://www.conwaylife.com/wiki/Centipede_caterloopillar has an RLE link in the "see also" section.

The weird thing about this is that the article has a pname of "centipedecaterloopillar" while the RLE is titled "caterloopillar31c240.rle". I would change the pname respectively, but since there happens to be an RLE namespace page under this name (RLE:Caterloopillar31c240) it attempts to generate a LifeViewer except it's also too large to fit inside it, so it gives an error. Anyone know if there's a way to suppress the viewer?
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Re: Suggested LifeWiki edits

Postby dvgrn » May 15th, 2019, 10:21 pm

Ian07 wrote:Anyone know if there's a way to suppress the viewer?

The simplest way I can think of is to remove the RLE:caterloopillar31c240 article, since it's not really doing any good now that the file has gotten onto the LifeWiki server. I'll try that.

We could try adjusting the template so that "rle = nolifeviewer" does the appropriate thing. Last time we dared to meddle with the templates, to get Catagolue glider synthesis links, it turned out pretty well... so it might not be a total disaster this time either. But I'm not sure it's really necessary. Files too big for LifeViewer are definitely the exception, and they can just be handled by the auto-upload script and then deleted from the RLE namespace (assuming this works.)
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