## Catagolue Oddities

For general discussion about Conway's Game of Life.

### Re: Catagolue Oddities

dvgrn wrote:I haven't quoted quite all of the relevant parts, unfortunately -- the link above is a better source if you really want to dig into what it's doing. Seems as if when it hits the second "3-" in each pair in "B3-a3-r/S23-a3-r", that resets the isotropic bits to all-ON... whereas it doesn't reset the bits to all-OFF when it hits the second "2" in "B2a2e".

This is reasonable.

The easiest way to prevent non-canonical rule strings is to use whatever algorithm you like to convert a rule string to an internal format, then convert that internal format into a canonical string, then reject the original string if it is not an exact match for the the canonical output string (or, to be kinder and gentler, just ignore the input string and use the sanitized output string).
mniemiec

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### Re: Catagolue Oddities

On the topic of "oddities" again-- here's another one of those "negative period" linear-growth patterns, yl1333_1_-446_07c8ba055394b68badc481cf4cc7a331 in B2cen3ackr4-jkryz5ckqy6-cn7e8/S12i3qy4aciw5-jkr6ak/D2_x.
If you speak, your speech must be better than your silence would have been. — Arabian proverb

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Apple Bottom

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### Re: Catagolue Oddities

Apple Bottom wrote:On the topic of "oddities" again-- here's another one of those "negative period" linear-growth patterns

Correction, the number that is negative here refers to the number of cells created each cycle, and it usually occurs when a linear growth becomes subject to a fuse and apgluxe thinks the soup has stabilized at the same time.
she/they // Please stop using my full name. Refer to me as dani.

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danny

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### Re: Catagolue Oddities

Oddity:
Try posting a comment on an object page but leave the comment section blank
If you're the person that uploaded to Sakagolue illegally, please PM me.
`x = 17, y = 10, rule = B3/S23b2ob2obo5b2o\$11b4obo\$2bob3o2bo2b3o\$bo3b2o4b2o\$o2bo2bob2o3b4o\$bob2obo5bo2b2o\$2b2o4bobo2b3o\$bo3b5ob2obobo\$2bo5bob2o\$4bob2o2bobobo!`

(Check gen 2)

Saka

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### Re: Catagolue Oddities

Saka wrote:Oddity:
Try posting a comment on an object page but leave the comment section blank

That's a deliberate spam-protection method. I think it also blocks a particular four-letter word, namely 'href'.
What do you do with ill crystallographers? Take them to the mono-clinic!

calcyman

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### Re: Catagolue Oddities

Saka wrote:Try posting a comment on an object page but leave the comment section blank

If you speak, your speech must be better than your silence would have been. — Arabian proverb

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Apple Bottom

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### Re: Catagolue Oddities

Apple Bottom wrote:
Saka wrote:Try posting a comment on an object page but leave the comment section blank

It's supposed to be a rickroll, but that's strange...wonder what country it's blocked in.
she/they // Please stop using my full name. Refer to me as dani.

"I'm always on duty, even when I'm off duty." -Cody Kolodziejzyk, Ph.D.

danny

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### Re: Catagolue Oddities

If you're the person that uploaded to Sakagolue illegally, please PM me.
`x = 17, y = 10, rule = B3/S23b2ob2obo5b2o\$11b4obo\$2bob3o2bo2b3o\$bo3b2o4b2o\$o2bo2bob2o3b4o\$bob2obo5bo2b2o\$2b2o4bobo2b3o\$bo3b5ob2obobo\$2bo5bob2o\$4bob2o2bobobo!`

(Check gen 2)

Saka

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Location: In the kingdom of Sultan Hamengkubuwono X

### Re: Catagolue Oddities

Hmm? No, that really is an oscillator:

`#C https://catagolue.appspot.com/object/xp288_cr996y2699rczzy0g8kaak8gzw69m9m99m9m96zy1125521/b3-ekny4y5as2-cn3-aek4ceiqy5aejkq6aci7e/D8_4x = 16, y = 23, rule = B3-ekny4y5a/S2-cn3-aek4ceiqy5aejkq6aci7eb3o8b3o\$bo2bo6bo2bo\$o3bo6bo3bo\$4o8b4o\$bo12bo7\$7b2o\$6bo2bo\$5bob2obo\$4bobo2bobo\$3bobob2obobo\$2bobobo2bobobo\$2bobobo2bobobo\$3bobob2obobo\$4bobo2bobo\$5bob2obo\$6bo2bo\$7b2o!`

And the still life at the bottom is part of it, too; if you remove it, the whole thing soon vanishes in a puff of logic.
If you speak, your speech must be better than your silence would have been. — Arabian proverb

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Apple Bottom

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### Re: Catagolue Oddities

Apple Bottom wrote:

Hmm? No, that really is an oscillator:

`#C https://catagolue.appspot.com/object/xp288_cr996y2699rczzy0g8kaak8gzw69m9m99m9m96zy1125521/b3-ekny4y5as2-cn3-aek4ceiqy5aejkq6aci7e/D8_4x = 16, y = 23, rule = B3-ekny4y5a/S2-cn3-aek4ceiqy5aejkq6aci7eb3o8b3o\$bo2bo6bo2bo\$o3bo6bo3bo\$4o8b4o\$bo12bo7\$7b2o\$6bo2bo\$5bob2obo\$4bobo2bobo\$3bobob2obobo\$2bobobo2bobobo\$2bobobo2bobobo\$3bobob2obobo\$4bobo2bobo\$5bob2obo\$6bo2bo\$7b2o!`

And the still life at the bottom is part of it, too; if you remove it, the whole thing soon vanishes in a puff of logic.

It's very odd then, because even though the object is identified correctly, the soup it comes from doesn't produce it - it makes the still-life being hit by 8 B-heptominos which kill each other. Even if you remove six of them, the two remaining ones hit the still-life and kill it, rather than oscillating. I don't see how apgsearch could possibly have derived this oscillator from this soup.
mniemiec

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### Re: Catagolue Oddities

mniemiec wrote:It's very odd then, because even though the object is identified correctly, the soup it comes from doesn't produce it - it makes the still-life being hit by 8 B-heptominos which kill each other. Even if you remove six of them, the two remaining ones hit the still-life and kill it, rather than oscillating. I don't see how apgsearch could possibly have derived this oscillator from this soup.

Huh, yeah. That is odd...

It might be worth rigging apgsearch to take a soup number on the command line in addition to a seed, and produce debug output on the console instead of uploading its results to see what's really going on here.
If you speak, your speech must be better than your silence would have been. — Arabian proverb

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Apple Bottom

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### Re: Catagolue Oddities

Apple Bottom wrote:It might be worth rigging apgsearch to take a soup number on the command line in addition to a seed, and produce debug output on the console instead of uploading its results to see what's really going on here.

Earlier, I had posted some patches that will make apgsearch analyze an arbitrary RLE file and store the results in a local log file. I used that to obtain yl_* apgcodes for all growing patterns I have in other rules that have not shown up in searches yet. You could use that to just enter the suspicious soup. (Due to input redirection, --rule must be recompiled into apgluxe before this is run).
(Unfortunately, for some reason, those changes broke apgsearch's authentication with payosha, so I would advise applying them only to a fork until a fix becomes available.)
Running it on the indicated soup generates the following log file:
`@VERSION v4.23-ll1.22@MD5 dc167ae5817f9908946ced645a610b31@ROOT l_gYybTdHaRbhK@RULE b3-ekny4y5as2-cn3-aek4ceiqy5aejkq6aci7e@SYMMETRY C1@NUM_SOUPS 1@NUM_OBJECTS 1@CENSUS TABLExp288_cr996y2699rczzy0g8kaak8gzw69m9m99m9m96zy1125521 1@SAMPLE_SOUPIDSxp288_cr996y2699rczzy0g8kaak8gzw69m9m99m9m96zy1125521 0`
mniemiec

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### Re: Catagolue Oddities

Apple Bottom wrote:
mniemiec wrote:It's very odd then, because even though the object is identified correctly, the soup it comes from doesn't produce it - it makes the still-life being hit by 8 B-heptominos which kill each other. Even if you remove six of them, the two remaining ones hit the still-life and kill it, rather than oscillating. I don't see how apgsearch could possibly have derived this oscillator from this soup.

Huh, yeah. That is odd...

It might be worth rigging apgsearch to take a soup number on the command line in addition to a seed, and produce debug output on the console instead of uploading its results to see what's really going on here.

Here's the soup. Maybe it's not being correctly emplaced into the universe?

`x = 32, y = 32, rule = B3-ekny4y5a/S2-cn3-aek4ceiqy5aejkq6aci7eooobobobobbbbbobbobbbbbobobobooo\$oobbobboooooooooooooooooobbobboo\$obbobbboboboobboobboobobobbbobbo\$bbobbboooboobbobbobboobooobbbobb\$oobbboboobboobboobboobboobobbboo\$bbbboboboboobooooooboobobobobbbb\$obbobobboobbobobbobobboobbobobbo\$boooobbboobbboooooobbboobbboooob\$oobooooooboobbobbobboobooooooboo\$boobbbooboobboobboobbooboobbboob\$bobobobbooooobbbbbbooooobbobobob\$booooobboboboobooboobobobbooooob\$boobobobbboobobbbboboobbboboboob\$bobbboboboboobooooboobobobobbbob\$oobobooooobbboboobobbboooooboboo\$booboobobbboboooooobobbbobooboob\$booboobobbboboooooobobbbobooboob\$oobobooooobbboboobobbboooooboboo\$bobbboboboboobooooboobobobobbbob\$boobobobbboobobbbboboobbboboboob\$booooobboboboobooboobobobbooooob\$bobobobbooooobbbbbbooooobbobobob\$boobbbooboobboobboobbooboobbboob\$oobooooooboobbobbobboobooooooboo\$boooobbboobbboooooobbboobbboooob\$obbobobboobbobobbobobboobbobobbo\$bbbboboboboobooooooboobobobobbbb\$oobbboboobboobboobboobboobobbboo\$bbobbboooboobbobbobboobooobbbobb\$obbobbboboboobboobboobobobbbobbo\$oobbobboooooooooooooooooobbobboo\$ooobobobobbbbbobbobbbbbobobobooo!`
What do you do with ill crystallographers? Take them to the mono-clinic!

calcyman

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Joined: June 1st, 2009, 4:32 pm

### Re: Catagolue Oddities

calcyman wrote:Here's the soup. Maybe it's not being correctly emplaced into the universe? ...

That's not likely, as my hacked up apgsearch that just creates soup images from an RLE file using C1 symmetry yields exactly the same results (see my previous message). It doesn't make this kind of mistake with any other files I've tried it with, so it appears to be a problem with apgsearch's analysis, rather than pattern entry.
mniemiec

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Joined: June 1st, 2013, 12:00 am

### Re: Catagolue Oddities

mniemiec wrote:
calcyman wrote:Here's the soup. Maybe it's not being correctly emplaced into the universe? ...

That's not likely, as my hacked up apgsearch that just creates soup images from an RLE file using C1 symmetry yields exactly the same results (see my previous message). It doesn't make this kind of mistake with any other files I've tried it with, so it appears to be a problem with apgsearch's analysis, rather than pattern entry.

Here's a soup which produces the oscillator. There are two extra On cells. There seem to be a fair number of similar soups which also produce the oscillator. I've no idea how this might explain the result.
`x = 32, y = 33, rule = B3-ekny4y5a/S2-cn3-aek4ceiqy5aejkq6aci7e15b2o\$3obobobo5bo2bo5bobobob3o\$2o2bo2b18o2bo2b2o\$o2bo3bobob2o2b2o2b2obobo3bo2bo\$2bo3b3ob2o2bo2bo2b2ob3o3bo\$2o3bob2o2b2o2b2o2b2o2b2obo3b2o\$4bobobob2ob6ob2obobobo\$o2bobo2b2o2bobo2bobo2b2o2bobo2bo\$b4o3b2o3b6o3b2o3b4o\$2ob6ob2o2bo2bo2b2ob6ob2o\$b2o3b2ob2o2b2o2b2o2b2ob2o3b2o\$bobobo2b5o6b5o2bobobo\$b5o2bobob2ob2ob2obobo2b5o\$b2obobo3b2obo4bob2o3bobob2o\$bo3bobobob2ob4ob2obobobo3bo\$2obob5o3bob2obo3b5obob2o\$b2ob2obo3bob6obo3bob2ob2o\$b2ob2obo3bob6obo3bob2ob2o\$2obob5o3bob2obo3b5obob2o\$bo3bobobob2ob4ob2obobobo3bo\$b2obobo3b2obo4bob2o3bobob2o\$b5o2bobob2ob2ob2obobo2b5o\$bobobo2b5o6b5o2bobobo\$b2o3b2ob2o2b2o2b2o2b2ob2o3b2o\$2ob6ob2o2bo2bo2b2ob6ob2o\$b4o3b2o3b6o3b2o3b4o\$o2bobo2b2o2bobo2bobo2b2o2bobo2bo\$4bobobob2ob6ob2obobobo\$2o3bob2o2b2o2b2o2b2o2b2obo3b2o\$2bo3b3ob2o2bo2bo2b2ob3o3bo\$o2bo3bobob2o2b2o2b2obobo3bo2bo\$2o2bo2b18o2bo2b2o\$3obobobo5bo2bo5bobobob3o!`
The latest version of the 5S Project contains over 196,000 spaceships. Tabulated pages up to period 160 are available on the LifeWiki.
wildmyron

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### Re: Catagolue Oddities

https://catagolue.appspot.com/census/b2 ... nq4/C1/xs1
It claims to have the dot still life but when you click it it says "The apgcode prefix does not accurately reflect the behaviour of the pattern encoded in the suffix under the specified rule. As such, the provided apgcode is invalid in this rule."

Actually the majority of the still life section looks like bs012345678

Majestas32

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### Re: Catagolue Oddities

Majestas32 wrote:Actually the majority of the still life section looks like bs012345678

Ah, this has happened before (muzik's copy errored out on the first adjustable spaceship rule iirc), and I'm curious of the cause.
she/they // Please stop using my full name. Refer to me as dani.

"I'm always on duty, even when I'm off duty." -Cody Kolodziejzyk, Ph.D.

danny

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### Re: Catagolue Oddities

Why is my haul blue?
Attachments
frKuSa
blue haul.png (158.76 KiB) Viewed 4395 times
If you're the person that uploaded to Sakagolue illegally, please PM me.
`x = 17, y = 10, rule = B3/S23b2ob2obo5b2o\$11b4obo\$2bob3o2bo2b3o\$bo3b2o4b2o\$o2bo2bob2o3b4o\$bob2obo5bo2b2o\$2b2o4bobo2b3o\$bo3b5ob2obobo\$2bo5bob2o\$4bob2o2bobobo!`

(Check gen 2)

Saka

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Joined: June 19th, 2015, 8:50 pm
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### Re: Catagolue Oddities

Saka wrote:Why is my haul blue?

IIRC different colors indicate different statuses. Blue corresponds to ?committed=6, but you'll have to ask Calcyman what the numbers mean exactly. The only ones I know for sure are 0 (new, unchecked) and 2 (committed). The rest have to do with statistical verification, peer review etc., most likely. (The number is also most likely a bitfield, so not all numbers may make sense.)
If you speak, your speech must be better than your silence would have been. — Arabian proverb

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Apple Bottom

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### Re: Catagolue Oddities

Apple Bottom wrote:IIRC different colors indicate different statuses. Blue corresponds to ?committed=6, but you'll have to ask Calcyman what the numbers mean exactly...

Oh alright. I also found commited=4 which is a brownish thing. I'll ask Calcyman.

Also, about the strange oscillator-soup thing, could it have been a neutrino incident?
If you're the person that uploaded to Sakagolue illegally, please PM me.
`x = 17, y = 10, rule = B3/S23b2ob2obo5b2o\$11b4obo\$2bob3o2bo2b3o\$bo3b2o4b2o\$o2bo2bob2o3b4o\$bob2obo5bo2b2o\$2b2o4bobo2b3o\$bo3b5ob2obobo\$2bo5bob2o\$4bob2o2bobobo!`

(Check gen 2)

Saka

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### Re: Catagolue Oddities

Blue means 'committed and considered important enough to preserve for all eternity'. Green hauls, by comparison, are eventually automatically deleted to save disk space (but of course the objects from them are safely tallied in the tabulations).
What do you do with ill crystallographers? Take them to the mono-clinic!

calcyman

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Joined: June 1st, 2009, 4:32 pm

### Re: Catagolue Oddities

calcyman wrote:Blue means 'committed and considered important enough to preserve for all eternity'.

But why? Because they contain "discoveries"? What about "?commited=4"? Does it mean "Nothing interesting at all"?
If you're the person that uploaded to Sakagolue illegally, please PM me.
`x = 17, y = 10, rule = B3/S23b2ob2obo5b2o\$11b4obo\$2bob3o2bo2b3o\$bo3b2o4b2o\$o2bo2bob2o3b4o\$bob2obo5bo2b2o\$2b2o4bobo2b3o\$bo3b5ob2obobo\$2bo5bob2o\$4bob2o2bobobo!`

(Check gen 2)

Saka

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Joined: June 19th, 2015, 8:50 pm
Location: In the kingdom of Sultan Hamengkubuwono X

### Re: Catagolue Oddities

Graph glitch:
graph glitch.png (78.73 KiB) Viewed 4268 times

Even weirder on benetnasch85's page
Ill never have as many contributions as this guy.png (66.2 KiB) Viewed 4267 times
If you're the person that uploaded to Sakagolue illegally, please PM me.
`x = 17, y = 10, rule = B3/S23b2ob2obo5b2o\$11b4obo\$2bob3o2bo2b3o\$bo3b2o4b2o\$o2bo2bob2o3b4o\$bob2obo5bo2b2o\$2b2o4bobo2b3o\$bo3b5ob2obobo\$2bo5bob2o\$4bob2o2bobobo!`

(Check gen 2)

Saka

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Joined: June 19th, 2015, 8:50 pm
Location: In the kingdom of Sultan Hamengkubuwono X

### Re: Catagolue Oddities

Catagolue does not seem to return the soups of inflated symmetries correctly. For example, the iD8_4 soups on the fumarole page, when clicked on, are formatted like C1 soups. Those C1-ized soups, to no one's surprise, do not produce a fumarole.
Tanner Jacobi

Kazyan

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### Re: Catagolue Oddities

she/they // Please stop using my full name. Refer to me as dani.

"I'm always on duty, even when I'm off duty." -Cody Kolodziejzyk, Ph.D.

danny

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