Let's create a language!

[Moosey]

A will be IPA a and E IPA e.

please don't tell me you pronounce the first two syllables of elephant "ay lay"

also, how will you differentiate the following?
/ŋ/ (ng) and /ng/ (also ng)
/ʃ/ (sh) and /sh/ (also sh)
/d͡ʒ/ (zh) and /zh/ (also zh) (oops wrote that as /dz/ lol)

[BokaBB]

A will be IPA a and E IPA e.

please don't tell me you pronounce the first two syllables of elephant "ay lay"

also, how will you differentiate the following?
/ŋ/ (ng) and /ng/ (also ng)
/ʃ/ (sh) and /sh/ (also sh)
/d͡ʒ/ (zh) and /dz/ (also zh)

No,we don't pronoumce that like that. The variability of English is one of the reasons why English won't be the world language.
We differentiate the last (the first is Џ and the second S,the latter found only in Macedonian altrough pronouncable for us).
I think the first in the second pair is softer than the latter and found in Russian.
Nothing significant about the first, except the speed.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

[Moosey]

A will be IPA a and E IPA e.

please don't tell me you pronounce the first two syllables of elephant "ay lay"

also, how will you differentiate the following?
/ŋ/ (ng) and /ng/ (also ng)
/ʃ/ (sh) and /sh/ (also sh)
/d͡ʒ/ (zh) and /zh/ (also zh)

[misinterprets me as asking how they are differentiated in real langs]
No,we don't pronoumce [sic] that like that. The variability of English is one of the reasons why English won't be the world language. [even though it's already used as the default language]
We differentiate the last (the first is Џ and the second S,the latter found only in Macedonian altrough [sic] pronouncable [sic] for us).
I think the first in the second pair is softer than the latter and found in Russian.
Nothing significant about the first, except the speed.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

no I meant: in this conlang how do you plan to differentiate them? will /ng/ be written n-g, for instance?

[BokaBB]

please don't tell me you pronounce the first two syllables of elephant "ay lay"

also, how will you differentiate the following?
/ŋ/ (ng) and /ng/ (also ng)
/ʃ/ (sh) and /sh/ (also sh)
/d͡ʒ/ (zh) and /zh/ (also zh)

No,we don't pronoumce that like that. The variability of English is one of the reasons why English won't be the world language. [even though it's already used as the default language]
We differentiate the last (the first is Џ and the second S,the latter found only in Macedonian altrough pronouncable for us).
I think the first in the second pair is softer than the latter and found in Russian.
Nothing significant about the first, except the speed.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

no I meant: in the conlang how do you plan to differentiate them? will /ng/ be written n-g, for instance?

Yes,sound /ng/ will be written ng.
I won't differentiate them, altrough I don't plan the language to have Џ sound.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

[Schiaparelliorbust]

Ok I will list all the sounds I think should be in the language with IPA symbols. Sounds with asterisks are subject to change. I did this because there are some sounds produced by letters (p, t, f, o, l, etc.) that have, as far as I'm concerned, have sounds we all agree on. Also, I didn't list c, k, and s because c might make sounds similar to the others.

a = /ɐ/*
b = /b/
d = /d/
e = /ɛ/*
f = /f/
g = /g/
h = /h/
i = /ɪ/
j = /ʒ/*
l = /l/
m = /m/
n = /n/
o = /o/
p = /p/ (for some reason on Wikipedia this sounded like a /b/, but on other sources sounded like p as in peach.)
r = /r/
t = /t/ (same thing as with p)
u = /u/*
v = /v/
y = /j/
z = /z/
sh = /ʃ/
ch = /t̠ʃ/
dj = /dʒ/*

Diphthongs:
ao = /ɐo/
ai = /ɐɪ/
au = /aʊ/*
eo = /ɛo/
ei = /eɪ/
ia = /ɪɐ/
io = /ɪo/
oa = /oɐ/
oi = /oi/
ua = /uɐ/

I would like to point out that there's no schwa (/ə/), though it is the most common vowel sound in English and is present in many other languages. It is usually formed when there's an unstressed vowel like the a in "about".

[BokaBB]

Ok I will list all the sounds I think should be in the language with IPA symbols. Sounds with asterisks are subject to change. I did this because there are some sounds produced by letters (p, t, f, o, l, etc.) that have, as far as I'm concerned, have sounds we all agree on. Also, I didn't list c, k, and s because c might make sounds similar to the others.

a = /ɐ/*
b = /b/
d = /d/
e = /ɛ/*
f = /f/
g = /g/
h = /h/
i = /ɪ/
j = /ʒ/*
l = /l/
m = /m/
n = /n/
o = /o/
p = /p/ (for some reason on Wikipedia this sounded like a /b/, but on other sources sounded like p as in peach.)
r = /r/
t = /t/ (same thing as with p)
u = /u/*
v = /v/
y = /j/
z = /z/
sh = /ʃ/
ch = /t̠ʃ/
dj = /dʒ/*

Diphthongs:
ao = /ɐo/
ai = /ɐɪ/
au = /aʊ/*
eo = /ɛo/
ei = /eɪ/
ia = /ɪɐ/
io = /ɪo/
oa = /oɐ/
oi = /oi/
ua = /uɐ/

I would like to point out that there's no schwa (/ə/), though it is the most common vowel sound in English and is present in many other languages. It is usually formed when there's an unstressed vowel like the a in "about".

I am not sure about the schwa,but it is more logical for A to be /a/and E to be /e/.
C should be present.
Forget Wikipedia,there is barely anything worthwhile on it.
You want au sound to be changed?Let's ask other people.
I feel our pronouns sound a bit alien compared to the rest of the words. I will think about should we change it.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

[Moosey]

I am not sure about the schwa,but it is more logical for A to be /a/and E to be /e/.
C should be present.


BokaBB

I disagree; it would be more logical for A to be /ɑ/ (as in hot), as opposed to /a/, and E to be /ɛ/ (as in bed) or /ə/ (as in about)

Additionally you originally ordained the following:

A:as a in a(article)
E:as e in elephant

that would make A /eɪ/, or possibly /ə/ depending on dialect and e /ɛ/ or /ə/ depending on the position in "elephant"

[Schiaparelliorbust]

I think a should be /ɐ/, it feels like that's the sound that would come if it was placed between to consonants: sama (chair) (sorry if this is not the way to defend my opinion). I do think c should exist, but we have to define where is makes /k/ and where it makes /s/. Making it always make either one of the sounds would render either the letter s or k redundant. Maybe c + e = /sɛ/ and c + i = /sɪ/ and in other cases should be pronounced /k/. E should be /ɛ/.

I am not sure about the schwa,but it is more logical for A to be /a/and E to be /e/.
C should be present.


BokaBB

I disagree; it would be more logical for A to be /ɑ/ (as in hot), as opposed to /a/, and E to be /ɛ/ (as in bed) or /ə/ (as in about)

Additionally you originally ordained the following:

A:as a in a(article)
E:as e in elephant

that would make A /eɪ/, or possibly /ə/ depending on dialect and e /ɛ/ or /ə/ depending on the position in "elephant"

I've never heard a in article be /eɪ/ (like a in play right?). Also the o in hot is /ɒ/, not /ɑ/.

I am not sure about the schwa,but it is more logical for A to be /a/and E to be /e/.
C should be present.
Forget Wikipedia,there is barely anything worthwhile on it.
You want au sound to be changed?Let's ask other people.
I feel our pronouns sound a bit alien compared to the rest of the words. I will think about should we change it.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

I use Wikipedia but I do use other sources. If Wikipedia sounds wrong, I look elsewhere.

[BokaBB]

I have a proposal.
All my words are one syllable or one syllable plus preffixes and suffixes.
What about changing the rest to fullfill this or giving them a meaning with some preffixes and suffixes?
Example:
Malun - man
-un - a person with some capability unrelated to work
Mal - language (NOT a name for this language,but for any language)
Male - tongue
For my ears o in hot is very /o/ or something close. I am not an IPA expert (but I have IQ 132 and I am intelligent enough to know all the states in the world and capital cities, altrough I am not sure if I will know these in English).
I wanted my language to be fully phonetical,but I am now bombarded by other views.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

[Schiaparelliorbust]

I have a proposal.
All my words are one syllable or one syllable plus preffixes and suffixes.
What about changing the rest to fullfill this or giving them a meaning with some preffixes and suffixes?
Example:
Malun - man
-un - a person with some capability unrelated to work
Mal - language (NOT a name for this language,but for any language)
Male - tongue

I don't think that all words should be 1 syllable + suffixes. We would run out of words pretty quickly.

For my ears o in hot is very /o/ or something close. I am not an IPA expert (but I have IQ 132 and I am intelligent enough to know all the states in the world and capital cities, altrough I am not sure if I will know these in English).

When I look up the pronunciation of hot, it says /hɒt/.

I wanted my language to be fully phonetical,but I am now bombarded by other views.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

As I said, we need to find a sound for c. By phonetic, you mean one sound per symbol, right? Are ch and sh allowed? In Turkish, we go around the problem of c by giving it the sound /dʒ/, making it entirely phonetic.

[Saka]

I definitely do not know all english dialects, but usually I hear "hot" as
[hɒt] or [hɔt] (I pronounce it the latter) (I've also heard some replace the t with a glottal stop ʔ but that's not what we're talking about here).

I'm quite sure though, that there probably is an english dialect/accent somewhere that pronounces it [hot].

[Schiaparelliorbust]

I definitely do not know all english dialects, but usually I hear "hot" as
[hɒt] or [hɔt] (I pronounce it the latter) (I've also heard some replace the t with a glottal stop ʔ but that's not what we're talking about here).

I'm quite sure though, that there probably is an english dialect/accent somewhere that pronounces it [hot].

In British English consonants (especially r) are often omitted or very lightly pronounced. Is that the same thing?

[BokaBB]

I am not really sure. I am not that often reading about IPA sounds.
Other proposals about the words with more than 1 syllable and no preffixes or suffixes?
Schaparellio,your words sound Turkish. I hope they aren't real Turkish words. I don't want the language to sound like Turkish.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

[Schiaparelliorbust]

I am not really sure. I am not that often reading about IPA sounds.
Other proposals about the words with more than 1 syllable and no preffixes or suffixes?
Schaparellio,your words sound Turkish. I hope they aren't real Turkish words. I don't want the language to sound like Turkish.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

They certainly aren't Turkish. It might sound like it, I really don't know. They might speak a type of Turkish near where you live that sounds more similar to these words I'm making. That Turkish is more original and unchanged, I can't understand it myself.

[BokaBB]

I am not really sure. I am not that often reading about IPA sounds.
Other proposals about the words with more than 1 syllable and no preffixes or suffixes?
Schaparellio,your words sound Turkish. I hope they aren't real Turkish words. I don't want the language to sound like Turkish.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

They certainly aren't Turkish. It might sound like it, I really don't know. They might speak a type of Turkish near where you live that sounds more similar to these words I'm making. That Turkish is more original and unchanged, I can't understand it myself.

No,there are no Turkish - speaking regions in Serbia. I watch your TV series a lot and know how its sounds and even a few words. Also,we have a huge number of your loanwords due to your long rule.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

[Schiaparelliorbust]

I am not really sure. I am not that often reading about IPA sounds.
Other proposals about the words with more than 1 syllable and no preffixes or suffixes?
Schaparellio,your words sound Turkish. I hope they aren't real Turkish words. I don't want the language to sound like Turkish.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

They certainly aren't Turkish. It might sound like it, I really don't know. They might speak a type of Turkish near where you live that sounds more similar to these words I'm making. That Turkish is more original and unchanged, I can't understand it myself.

No,there are no Turkish - speaking regions in Serbia. I watch your TV series a lot and know how its sounds and even a few words.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

I am not really sure. I am not that often reading about IPA sounds.
Other proposals about the words with more than 1 syllable and no preffixes or suffixes?
Schaparellio,your words sound Turkish. I hope they aren't real Turkish words. I don't want the language to sound like Turkish.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

They certainly aren't Turkish. It might sound like it, I really don't know. They might speak a type of Turkish near where you live that sounds more similar to these words I'm making. That Turkish is more original and unchanged, I can't understand it myself.

No,there are no Turkish - speaking regions in Serbia. I watch your TV series a lot and know how its sounds and even a few words.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

There are still Turks in the Balkans so I thought maybe. Sorry if my words sound Turkish - I'll try to make them more varied. Also, no offense but I think that most Turkish TV shows are really badly made. Let's not forget what we're her for. Let's talk about the language some. What sound should c make? Please answer my question about what phonetic actually means, too.

[BokaBB]

C should be /ts/ or /c/. /c/ is similar but not the same to Ћ (failed to find a way to input its sound). Can it be that sound or /ts/?
Have a good day!

BokaBB

[Schiaparelliorbust]

Maybe it could be /t̠ʃ/ and we get rid of ch. What is Ћ? Also, is sh allowed or would that make it non-phonetic?

[BokaBB]

Maybe it could be /t̠ʃ/ and we get rid of ch. What is Ћ? Also, is sh allowed or would that make it non-phonetic?

I think the sh and ch (and maybe zh) can thrive. Ћ is like /t/ and /j/ pronounced quickly together.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

[Schiaparelliorbust]

Could you give the IPA equivalent of zh please?

[BokaBB]

Could you give the IPA equivalent of zh please?

Can't on laptop,but z with some curve.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

[Schiaparelliorbust]

Could you give the IPA equivalent of zh please?

Can't on laptop,but z with some curve.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

There is more than one symbol like that. Please use this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPA_pulmo ... with_audio

[Saka]

C should be /ts/ or /c/. /c/ is similar but not the same to Ћ (failed to find a way to input its sound). Can it be that sound or /ts/?
Have a good day!

BokaBB

The sound Ћ makes according to my google is completely different from /c/. (According to my google machine again, it represents the sound /tɕ/)

Could you give the IPA equivalent of zh please?

ʒ I'm pretty sure.

[Schiaparelliorbust]

C should be /ts/ or /c/. /c/ is similar but not the same to Ћ (failed to find a way to input its sound). Can it be that sound or /ts/?
Have a good day!

BokaBB

The sound Ћ makes according to my google is completely different from /c/. (According to my google machine again, it represents the sound /tɕ/)

Could you give the IPA equivalent of zh please?

ʒ I'm pretty sure.

Ok then, I think using /t̠ʃ/ gets rid of the problem of c being able to be /s/ and /k/. We should keep using sh as /ʃ/ and I'm totally fine with using zh as /ʒ/, but then j should be /dʒ/.

[Moosey]

I definitely do not know all english dialects, but usually I hear "hot" as
[hɒt] or [hɔt] (I pronounce it the latter) (I've also heard some replace the t with a glottal stop ʔ but that's not what we're talking about here).

I'm quite sure though, that there probably is an english dialect/accent somewhere that pronounces it [hot].

I definitely use ɑ rather than ɒ in "hot". Maybe we should just make it so that ɑ/ɒ are allophones?

Ok then, I think using /t̠ʃ/ gets rid of the problem of c being able to be /s/ and /k/. We should keep using sh as /ʃ/ and I'm totally fine with using zh as /ʒ/, but then j should be /dʒ/ [presumably the affricate]

Imo /d͡ʒ/ should be "dzh" (/dʒ/ as a pair of consonants rather than an affricate would be "d-zh") ; that way "j" can be /j/.







Also (to boka) basically nobody (or at least apparently neither of saka and I) in this thread knows serbian cyrillic, can you please use ipa? just copy-paste from a chart?