Country CA

[Schiaparelliorbust]

Please use my idea,your makes problems which even I can't explain well (I have IQ 132).
Have a good day!

BokaBB

Are wall cells supposed to connect?

[BokaBB]

Please use my idea,your makes problems which even I can't explain well (I have IQ 132).
Have a good day!

BokaBB

Are wall cells supposed to connect?

I my original idea yes because they couldn't otherwise block Territory from expanding,altrough we can change that using some weird methods.
I recommend my original idea.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

[Schiaparelliorbust]

I my original idea yes because they couldn't otherwise block Territory from expanding,altrough we can change that using some weird methods.
I recommend my original idea.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

I don't see how them being connected would make any difference. I also read my post and didn't see anything self-contradictory.

[BokaBB]

I my original idea yes because they couldn't otherwise block Territory from expanding,altrough we can change that using some weird methods.
I recommend my original idea.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

I don't see how them being connected would make any difference. I also read my post and didn't see anything self-contradictory.

Have you ever tested your IQ?Sorry if that sounded bad,but this is practically impossible not to understand.
If there are gaps in the wall,Territory could freely expand trough them.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

[Schiaparelliorbust]

Have you ever tested your IQ?Sorry if that sounded bad,but this is practically impossible not to understand.
If there are gaps in the wall,Territory could freely expand trough them.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

Yes, multiples times. I once got 147, the other time I got 136, though I don't think it matters that much. I guess you do have a point where the territory/army can seep through gaps an the walls. Maybe we could make it so that 6 army cells create a wall, and 7 or 8 enemy army cells can destroy it. That way walls will be easier to create and have fewer gaps.

[fluffykitty]

Even with those rules it's easy to make indestructible barriers (eg block). To ensure that walls are always destructible, they must be destructible with at most 4 armies. I suggest an army cell, 4+ army cells around it, and an enemy territory cell can make a wall, and 4+ enemy armies and luck can destroy one.

[Schiaparelliorbust]

Even with those rules it's easy to make indestructible barriers (eg block). To ensure that walls are always destructible, they must be destructible with at most 4 armies. I suggest an army cell, 4+ army cells around it, and an enemy territory cell can make a wall, and 4+ enemy armies and luck can destroy one.

I think making walls easily destructible just renders them useless. Maybe only territory cells that border another country's any type of cell can be turned into a wall. Luck already plays a role in how the armies and territories move. I don't think that more luck is needed.

[fluffykitty]

I think we should make a no-wall version of the rule before deciding exactly how walls should work.

[Schiaparelliorbust]

I think we should make a no-wall version of the rule before deciding exactly how walls should work.

Good idea. Are you okay with running the Replicator CA (B1357/S1357) inside the territory, and one for every territory (Replicator CAs in different territories don't interact directly) as a source of randomness? Hunting said it wouldn't work because it is reversible but because the territory constantly changes shape, it shouldn't be.

[fluffykitty]

Yeah, that's fine. Plus, even if it was reversible, it'd still be unpredictable enough to be useful.

[Schiaparelliorbust]

Yeah, that's fine. Plus, even if it was reversible, it'd still be unpredictable enough to be useful.

I think if territory/army cells are in the majority around an empty cell that cell should always become a territory cell. Otherwise I think t should be 50/50. We should define neighbourhood states for where it does/doesn't expand.

[fluffykitty]

Here's a script for generating a territory-only version of the rule:

Code: Select all

print("""@RULE Warfare
0 empty
1 red rng0
2 red rng1
3 green rng0
4 green rng1
5 blue rng0
6 blue rng1
@TABLE
n_states:7
neighborhood:Moore
symmetries:none""")
countries=3
for i in range(9):
	print("var a"+str(i)+"={",end="")
	for j in range(countries*2):
		print(j,end=",")
	print(str(countries*2)+"}")
for i in range(countries):
	print("var b"+str(i)+"={",end="")
	for j in range(countries):
		if i==j:
			continue
		print(str(2*j+1)+","+str(2*j+2),end=",")
	print("}")
	for j in range(9):
		print("var c"+str(i)+str(j)+"={"+str(2*i+1)+","+str(2*i+2)+"}")
		print("var d"+str(i)+str(j)+"={0,"+str(2*i+1)+",b"+str(i)+"}")
for i in range(countries):
	for j in range(256):
		j2=j
		c=0
		while j2>0:
			c+=j2&1
			j2//=2
		if c==5:
			print("0,",end="")
			j2=j
			ac=1
			cc=0
			for k in range(8):
				if j2&1:
					print("c"+str(i)+str(cc),end=",")
					cc+=1
				else:
					print("a"+str(ac),end=",")
					ac+=1
				j2//=2
			print(str(i*2+1))
		if c==6:
			print("b"+str(i)+",",end="")
			j2=j
			ac=1
			cc=0
			for k in range(8):
				if j2&1:
					print("c"+str(i)+str(cc),end=",")
					cc+=1
				else:
					print("a"+str(ac),end=",")
					ac+=1
				j2//=2
			print(str(i*2+1))
for i in range(countries):
	for j in range(256):
		j2=j
		c=0
		dc=0
		print("c"+str(i)+"0,",end="")
		for k in range(8):
			c+=j2&1
			if j2&1:
				print("d"+str(i)+str(dc),end=",")
				dc+=1
			else:
				print(str(i*2+2),end=",")
			j2//=2
		if c%2:
			print(str(i*2+2))
		else:
			print(str(i*2+1))
print("""@COLORS
0 0 0 0
1 255 0 0
2 255 127 127
3 0 255 0
4 127 255 127
5 0 0 255
6 127 127 255""")

[Schiaparelliorbust]

Here's a script for generating a territory-only version of the rule:

Code: Select all

print("""@RULE Warfare
0 empty
1 red rng0
2 red rng1
3 green rng0
4 green rng1
5 blue rng0
6 blue rng1
@TABLE
n_states:7
neighborhood:Moore
symmetries:none""")
countries=3
for i in range(9):
	print("var a"+str(i)+"={",end="")
	for j in range(countries*2):
		print(j,end=",")
	print(str(countries*2)+"}")
for i in range(countries):
	print("var b"+str(i)+"={",end="")
	for j in range(countries):
		if i==j:
			continue
		print(str(2*j+1)+","+str(2*j+2),end=",")
	print("}")
	for j in range(9):
		print("var c"+str(i)+str(j)+"={"+str(2*i+1)+","+str(2*i+2)+"}")
		print("var d"+str(i)+str(j)+"={0,"+str(2*i+1)+",b"+str(i)+"}")
for i in range(countries):
	for j in range(256):
		j2=j
		c=0
		while j2>0:
			c+=j2&1
			j2//=2
		if c==5:
			print("0,",end="")
			j2=j
			ac=1
			cc=0
			for k in range(8):
				if j2&1:
					print("c"+str(i)+str(cc),end=",")
					cc+=1
				else:
					print("a"+str(ac),end=",")
					ac+=1
				j2//=2
			print(str(i*2+1))
		if c==6:
			print("b"+str(i)+",",end="")
			j2=j
			ac=1
			cc=0
			for k in range(8):
				if j2&1:
					print("c"+str(i)+str(cc),end=",")
					cc+=1
				else:
					print("a"+str(ac),end=",")
					ac+=1
				j2//=2
			print(str(i*2+1))
for i in range(countries):
	for j in range(256):
		j2=j
		c=0
		dc=0
		print("c"+str(i)+"0,",end="")
		for k in range(8):
			c+=j2&1
			if j2&1:
				print("d"+str(i)+str(dc),end=",")
				dc+=1
			else:
				print(str(i*2+2),end=",")
			j2//=2
		if c%2:
			print(str(i*2+2))
		else:
			print(str(i*2+1))
print("""@COLORS
0 0 0 0
1 255 0 0
2 255 127 127
3 0 255 0
4 127 255 127
5 0 0 255
6 127 127 255""")

Wow thanks! There isn't any pseudorandomness in it right?
Edit: By that I mean there isn't any pseudorandomness in the rule itself.

[fluffykitty]

Territory cells have two versions which behave as in B1357S1357, but that has no effect on actual territory expansion in this version.

[Schiaparelliorbust]

Territory cells have two versions which behave as in B1357S1357, but that has no effect on actual territory expansion in this version.

It should have an effect. It should be deterministic but unpredictable.

[fluffykitty]

It probably wouldn't be too hard to make territory expand with 4 territory neighbors and luck. However, the effects of randomness should be on armies, not natural territory expansion.

[Schiaparelliorbust]

It probably wouldn't be too hard to make territory expand with 4 territory neighbors and luck. However, the effects of randomness should be on armies, not natural territory expansion.

The how should territory expand? I think that randomness should affect territory expansion. We could say like 2i and 2k etc. cause a territory birth in the vacuum.

[fluffykitty]

AFAIK territory expansion is supposed to be caused by armies, which are not in this version.

[Schiaparelliorbust]

AFAIK territory expansion is supposed to be caused by armies, which are not in this version.

No, I don't think that's how it works. Armies take over another country's territory, not the vacuum AFAIK.

[fluffykitty]

Why can't they also take over the vacuum?

[Schiaparelliorbust]

Why can't they also take over the vacuum?

I don't see why they should, but I also don't really see why they shouldn't. Territory cells should grow on their own I think.

[fluffykitty]

Well, it probably wouldn't be too hard to add something like that.

[Schiaparelliorbust]

Well, it probably wouldn't be too hard to add something like that.

Let's try birth with 2i,2k and 3a.

[fluffykitty]

3a would probably cause weird squarish corners and the other two wouldn't apply very often.

[Schiaparelliorbust]

3a would probably cause weird squarish corners and the other two wouldn't apply very often.

I don't think so. B2k especially would keep the shape interesting.