Let's create an alien biosphere!

[Schiaparelliorbust]

We can do that as soon as we finish covering the increased biodiversity caused by hydrothermal vents near the surface.

Good. How might they diversify now?

[MathAndCode]

Good. How might they diversify now?

Have we discussed the reactions involving nitrogen-containing compounds yet?

[Schiaparelliorbust]

Have we discussed the reactions involving nitrogen-containing compounds yet?

Yes, but I don't think we ever said we were finished with them.

[MathAndCode]

Yes, but I don't think we ever said we were finished with them.

Let's continue to cover that, then. Isocyanic acid will have been abundant early on, so it's possible that the organisms will form peptide bonds from isocyanate groups and hydroxyl groups instead of from amine groups and carboxyl groups. I like that idea because it fits together well with some organisms adding isocyanate groups to carbon chains as a form of energy storage.

[Schiaparelliorbust]

Let's continue to cover that, then. Isocyanic acid will have been abundant early on, so it's possible that the organisms will form peptide bonds from isocyanate groups and hydroxyl groups instead of from amine groups and carboxyl groups. I like that idea because it fits together well with some organisms adding isocyanate groups to carbon chains as a form of energy storage.

Are these that organisms already use isocyanate? I like the idea too.

[MathAndCode]

Are these that organisms already use isocyanate?

Yes, that's what I mean.

[Schiaparelliorbust]

Yes, that's what I mean.

So what will happen with them (if anything)?

[MathAndCode]

So what will happen with them (if anything)?

Since they all evolved from the same ancestor, all organisms would share the same basic way of making protein analogues.
However, I just remembered that some amino acids have been known to form naturally, and even more have been seen to form in laboratory experiments meant to emulate the conditions in early Earth, so using amine and carboxyl groups might be more realistic than using isocyanate and hydroxyl groups.

[Schiaparelliorbust]

Since they all evolved from the same ancestor, all organisms would share the same basic way of making protein analogues.
However, I just remembered that some amino acids have been known to form naturally, and even more have been seen to form in laboratory experiments meant to emulate the conditions in early Earth, so using amine and carboxyl groups might be more realistic than using isocyanate and hydroxyl groups.

Yes, that sounds better to me now that you've said that. Could they use the high energy of isocyanate for something else maybe?

[MathAndCode]

Yes, that sounds better to me now that you've said that. Could they use the high energy of isocyanate for something else maybe?

Some organisms use isocyanate groups for energy storage. However, if isocyanic acid is more abundant in our planet's early atmosphere than in Earth's early atmosphere, isocyanate groups might be more realistic in our planet.

[Schiaparelliorbust]

Some organisms use isocyanate groups for energy storage. However, if isocyanic acid is more abundant in our planet's early atmosphere than in Earth's early atmosphere, isocyanate groups might be more realistic in our planet.

So do you want them to be isocyanate or amino groups?

I'm making a part on my user page dedicated to this. I'm adding the planet's stats, but I can't find some of them. They are:
Day length (Was the day twice as long as the night? I found something saying that, but we were going to create another planet, so what I found might have been about it.)
Axial tilt
Distance between the suns
Edit: I'm pretty sure the distance between the suns is 1.2 AU.

[MathAndCode]

So do you want them to be isocyanate or amino groups?

Let's have them use isocyanate groups. The same reaction with carbon dioxide that can turn ammonia into isocyanic acid can turn an amine group (as long as it isn't tertiary) into an isocyanate group.

Day length (Was the day twice as long as the night? I found something saying that, but we were going to create another planet, so what I found might have been about it.)

We considered that, but we decided against it.

Axial tilt

I think that we agreed that it would be less than that of Earth, but I'm not completely sure.

Distance between the suns
Edit: I'm pretty sure the distance between the suns is 1.2 AU.

Yes, that's correct.

[Schiaparelliorbust]

Let's have them use isocyanate groups. The same reaction with carbon dioxide that can turn ammonia into isocyanic acid can turn an amine group (as long as it isn't tertiary) into an isocyanate group.

What reaction is that? Also, does tertiary mean?

We considered that, but we decided against it.

Yes, that's correct.

I think we've run into a problem here. How are the suns and planet all at the same distances from each other while the planet is not in the Lagrange point?

I think that we agreed that it would be less than that of Earth, but I'm not completely sure.

During a cycle that averages about 40,000 years, the tilt of the axis varies between 22.1 and 24.5 degrees.

I say about the same cycle length with the range being between 21.9 and 24 degrees.

[MathAndCode]

What reaction is that? Also, does tertiary mean?

The reaction can be thought of as a double displacement reaction where a carbonyl group switches places with two hydrogen atoms. In a tertiary amine, the nitrogen atom is bonded to three carbon atoms. A secondary amine means that the nitrogen atom is bonded to two carbon atoms and one hydrogen atom (and now that I think about it, the reaction wouldn't work for secondary amines either), and a primary amine means that the nitrogen atom is bonded to one carbon atom and two hydrogen atoms. Theoretically, ammonia could be thought of as a zero-ary (nullary?) amine, as the nitrogen atom is bonded to zero carbon atoms and three hydrogen atoms.

I think we've run into a problem here. How are the suns and planet all at the same distances from each other while the planet is not in the Lagrange point?

We agreed that the planet would orbit much farther away from the stars instead of at their Lagrange point. Technically, the planet will be a little closer to one star or the other except at brief instants, but planet orbits far enough away from the stars' barycenter relative to the stars' separation that the maximum difference between the planet's distance to the two stars is small enough to be negligible.

I say about the same cycle length with the range being between 21.9 and 24 degrees.

That's fine with me.

[Schiaparelliorbust]

The reaction can be thought of as a double displacement reaction where a carbonyl group switches places with two hydrogen atoms. In a tertiary amine, the nitrogen atom is bonded to three carbon atoms. A secondary amine means that the nitrogen atom is bonded to two carbon atoms and one hydrogen atom (and now that I think about it, the reaction wouldn't work for secondary amines either), and a primary amine means that the nitrogen atom is bonded to one carbon atom and two hydrogen atoms. Theoretically, ammonia could be thought of as a zero-ary (nullary?) amine, as the nitrogen atom is bonded to zero carbon atoms and three hydrogen atoms.

What important differences might there be between this and amino acid proteins?

We agreed that the planet would orbit much farther away from the stars instead of at their Lagrange point. Technically, the planet will be a little closer to one star or the other except at brief instants, but planet orbits far enough away from the stars' barycenter relative to the stars' separation that the maximum difference between the planet's distance to the two stars is small enough to be negligible.

Then the planet is 1.2 AU from the suns, and how far are the suns from each other?

[MathAndCode]

What important differences might there be between this and amino acid proteins?

There aren't any differences in the actual proteins. The bonds are the same. They're just made in a different way.

Then the planet is 1.2 AU from the suns, and how far are the suns from each other?

I looked back, and I wasn't able to find it. Should I do the calculations again?

[Schiaparelliorbust]

There aren't any differences in the actual proteins. The bonds are the same. They're just made in a different way.

Oh, ok, I misunderstood.

I looked back, and I wasn't able to find it. Should I do the calculations again?

Yes please.

[MathAndCode]

Yes please.

Let's have them be 0.17 AU away from each other and have their orbital eccentricity be 0.4.

[Schiaparelliorbust]

Let's have them be 0.17 AU away from each other and have their orbital eccentricity be 0.4.

Thanks! Do binary stars have a higher orbital eccentricity because their masses are comparable? Earth's eccentricity is 0.0167086.

Are there any other reactions you want to cover?

[MathAndCode]

Thanks! Do binary stars have a higher orbital eccentricity because their masses are comparable? Earth's eccentricity is 0.0167086.

If I recall correctly, Artifexian said that binary stars have an eccentricity between 0.4 and 0.7

Are there any other reactions you want to cover?

I can't think of anything. However, over the past four days or so, I've been wondering whether we should voluntarily limit or cease our posting in this thread due to what's happening in the sandbox as a whole and the fact that this thread isn't about cellular autonoma. I understand that compared to the word chains thread, this thread doesn't accumulate as many posts per day and tends to have longer posts on average, but I still think that it might be a good idea to decrease or stop posting here until the ongoing sandbox upheaval is over.

[Schiaparelliorbust]

I can't think of anything. However, over the past four days or so, I've been wondering whether we should voluntarily limit or cease our posting in this thread due to what's happening in the sandbox as a whole and the fact that this thread isn't about cellular autonoma. I understand that compared to the word chains thread, this thread doesn't accumulate as many posts per day and tends to have longer posts on average, but I still think that it might be a good idea to decrease or stop posting here until the ongoing sandbox upheaval is over.

Yes, I was thinking that too. Maybe I can make a Discord account and we can continue it over there or something.

[PkmnQ]

I can't think of anything. However, over the past four days or so, I've been wondering whether we should voluntarily limit or cease our posting in this thread due to what's happening in the sandbox as a whole and the fact that this thread isn't about cellular autonoma. I understand that compared to the word chains thread, this thread doesn't accumulate as many posts per day and tends to have longer posts on average, but I still think that it might be a good idea to decrease or stop posting here until the ongoing sandbox upheaval is over.

Yes, I was thinking that too. Maybe I can make a Discord account and we can continue it over there or something.

The way I understand the situation currently, the sandbox itself isn't the problem, it's just the fact you can be toxic to others. I don't think you can insult anyone in this thread, so I think this thread is fine.