Switch engine Methuselahs

For discussion of specific patterns or specific families of patterns, both newly-discovered and well-known.
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TWLife
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Switch engine Methuselahs

Post by TWLife » September 27th, 2013, 9:51 pm

I've recently been working on Switch engine Methuselahs, the're quite interesting, so here's a 35 cell Methuselah that lasts for over 1.5 million gens. however, it doesn't start within a 20x20 box, so it's shouldn't really be considered a Methuselah.

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x = 170, y = 180, rule = B3/S23
167b3o74$50b4o$54bo$54bo$55b2o5$42bo$42bo$42bo$42bo$43b2o$45bo$45bo70$
2b4o$6bo$6bo$7b2o12$o$o$o$o$b2o$3bo$3bo!
And the thing in the bottom left corner isn't the lowest amount of cells required to produce the SE, I just don't know where to find them. So really, it should be about 28 cells or something...

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dvgrn
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Re: Switch engine Methuselahs

Post by dvgrn » September 27th, 2013, 10:32 pm

Are you familiar with Nick Gotts' weblog? His ark patterns seem somewhat along these lines, and it looks like many of his patterns have similarly long "eventful histories".
TWLife wrote:...the thing in the bottom left corner isn't the lowest amount of cells required to produce the SE, I just don't know where to find them.
Your SE predecessors are 8 cells, and all of Nick Gotts' switch engines seem to get started with 8-cell predecessors, so I strongly suspect you won't find anything with 7 cells or less.

But I think you mean that you don't really need the top switch engine in the pair at the bottom, since you just end up with a single block-laying SE once the debris settles. Probably just a block or blinker somewhere will allow the block-laying switch engine to escape, but I don't seem to have an example handy.

towerator
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Re: Switch engine Methuselahs

Post by towerator » September 28th, 2013, 2:30 am

Actualy "arkoids" aren't considered methusalehs for some...
it's because they are basically soups continuously shot by dirty backrakes.
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TWLife
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Re: Switch engine Methuselahs

Post by TWLife » September 30th, 2013, 1:22 am

dvgrn wrote:Are you familiar with Nick Gotts' weblog? His ark patterns seem somewhat along these lines, and it looks like many of his patterns have similarly long "eventful histories".
TWLife wrote:...the thing in the bottom left corner isn't the lowest amount of cells required to produce the SE, I just don't know where to find them.
Your SE predecessors are 8 cells, and all of Nick Gotts' switch engines seem to get started with 8-cell predecessors, so I strongly suspect you won't find anything with 7 cells or less.

But I think you mean that you don't really need the top switch engine in the pair at the bottom, since you just end up with a single block-laying SE once the debris settles. Probably just a block or blinker somewhere will allow the block-laying switch engine to escape, but I don't seem to have an example handy.
actually, I think there is a 9 or 10 cell pattern that also results in a single switch engine

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dvgrn
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Re: Switch engine Methuselahs

Post by dvgrn » September 30th, 2013, 4:50 am

TWLife wrote:actually, I think there is a 9 or 10 cell pattern that also results in a single switch engine
Ah, yes -- thanks for jogging my memory (I keep most of my memory online these days, it seems.) So a somewhat equivalent pattern would be

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#C 29-cell methuselah becomes boring at 3,256,766 ticks
x = 163, y = 163, rule = B3/S23
160b3o74$43b4o$47bo$47bo$48b2o5$35bo$35bo$35bo$35bo$36b2o$38bo$38bo69$
6bo$4bob2o$4bobo$4bo$2bo$obo!
Luckily the 10-cell switch-engine predecessor leaves some exhaust that suppresses the first high-period interaction between the two c/12 puffers, so the pattern stays interesting for twice as long. Are there similar high-period interactions between just two switch engines, or do you need all three?

TWLife
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Re: Switch engine Methuselahs

Post by TWLife » October 3rd, 2013, 12:00 am

well, I don't actually know... but I think 3 gives more possibilities....

NickGotts
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Re: Switch engine Methuselahs

Post by NickGotts » December 2nd, 2013, 3:01 pm

I must get round to updating that ancient "blog" (I didn't actually get the idea of a blog when I created it)! Yes, I 've done quite a bit, most of it I'm afraid never written up anywhere, on patterns that keep on producing novelty for a long time. The smallest (in terms of number of initial on-cells) I've found that go on as far as I've been able to trace them (although I suspect they don't last forever), have 32 cells, like this one:
#lj2ah-ohhsf-w344s1250
x = 386, y = 1273, rule = B3/S23
347bo$347bo$347bo$347bo$345b2o$344bo$344bo12$384bo$383bobo2$382bo2bo$
382b2o$382bo1227$31bo$31b2o$31bo2bo2$32bobo$33bo13$o3bo$bobo$2bo2bo$5b
o$5bo!

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