## is this c/10 spaceship known?

For discussion of specific patterns or specific families of patterns, both newly-discovered and well-known.
gameoflifemaniac
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### Re: is this c/10 spaceship known?

glider_rider wrote:Here's a way to do it with just a glider that I posted earlier.

Code: Select all

x = 15, y = 27, rule = B3/S23
3b2o2b2o$3b2o2b2o$2b3o2b3o$2b3o2b3o2$2bo6bo$2bo2b2o2bo$3b6o3$5b2o$4bo
2bo$4b4o$3b2o2b2o$o2bo4bo2bo$3bo4bo$4b4o$o10bo$bo8bo2$5b2o4$13bo$12b2o
$12bobo!  But how about a stable fireship-to-copperhead? I was so socially awkward in the past and it will haunt me for the rest of my life. Code: Select all x = 21, y = 5, rule = B3/S23 b2o2bo2b2o2b2o2bobobo$o3bobobobobobobobobo$bo2bobob2o2b2o3bo2bo$2bobob
obobobobo2bo$2o3bo2bobobobo2bo2bo!  toroidalet Posts: 1140 Joined: August 7th, 2016, 1:48 pm Location: My computer Contact: ### Re: is this c/10 spaceship known? gameoflifemaniac wrote: But how about a stable fireship-to-copperhead? Here's a start: Code: Select all x = 27, y = 21, rule = B3/S23 3b2o2b2o$3b2o2b2o$2b3o2b3o$2b3o2b3o11bo$19b3o$2bo6bo8bo$2bo2b2o2bo8b2o$3b6o$25b2o$25bo$5b2o16bobo$4bo2bo15b2o$4b4o5b2ob2o$3b2o2b2o4b2obo$o2b o4bo2bo4bo$3bo4bo7b2o$4b4o$o10bo$bo8bo2$5b2o!

To continue: restore the block on table and leave an excess glider to hit the ship. Shouldn't be too hard.
"Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life."

-Terry Pratchett

dvgrn
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### Re: is this c/10 spaceship known?

toroidalet wrote:
gameoflifemaniac wrote: But how about a stable fireship-to-copperhead?
Here's a start...
To continue: restore the block on table and leave an excess glider to hit the ship. Shouldn't be too hard.
I was working on something along the same lines, but without the eaters -- seems like those would get in the way of reconstruction, or at least slow down the repeat time since a lot of gliders would have to cross the fireship lane.

With a ten-minute investigation I could only come up with a four-object proof of concept:

Code: Select all

x = 21, y = 69, rule = B3/S23
3b2ob2o$2bobob2o$3bo3$2o$2o8$4b2o$4b2o15$3b2ob2o$2bobob2o$3bo3$2o$2o8$
4b2o$4b2o3$12b2o2b2o$12b2o2b2o$11b3o2b3o$11b3o2b3o2$11bo6bo$11bo2b2o2b o$12b6o3$14b2o$13bo2bo$13b4o$12b2o2b2o$9bo2bo4bo2bo$12bo4bo$13b4o$9bo
10bo$10bo8bo2$14b2o!
A detector -- preferably using an easier-to-construct bait than either this or the block-on-table, if someone can dig one up -- would split the output signal(s) as necessary, to rebuild the bait and send a timed glider forward to demote the fireship to a copperhead.

Theoretically a bait object with only one protruding cell will also interact with the fireship's sparks, slightly later, but everything I tried destroyed the fireship pretty quickly -- at least with no further catalysts added.

Is there a synthesis that would allow "firing up" a copperhead after it's already in motion? That would require a much uglier converter, though, since I don't think there are any Heisenburp options available for a plain copperhead. (?)

Even if a stable Heisenburp-type reaction could be found, it would probably be just as easy to use a nice simple copperhead-to-glider converter, and then wire up a glider-to-fireship. There's also a fireship-to-glider, but I think for that case the Heisenburp approach will probably be a little more reasonable than rebuilding an entire copperhead.

Extrementhusiast
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### Re: is this c/10 spaceship known?

This produces a sideways HWSS from a block on ship with catalyzing tub (unfortunately, the tub, which becomes a boat, later gets in the way of the fireship, but only just):

Code: Select all

x = 19, y = 21, rule = B3/S23
10b2o2b2o$10b2o2b2o$9b3o2b3o$9b3o2b3o2$9bo6bo$4bo4bo2b2o2bo$3bobo4b6o$4bo2$12b2o$2o9bo2bo$obob2o5b4o$b2ob2o4b2o2b2o$7bo2bo4bo2bo$10bo4bo$11b
4o$7bo10bo$8bo8bo2$12b2o!  I Like My Heisenburps! (and others) toroidalet Posts: 1140 Joined: August 7th, 2016, 1:48 pm Location: My computer Contact: ### Re: is this c/10 spaceship known? A different way to proceed: Code: Select all x = 22, y = 21, rule = B3/S23 7b2o2b2o$7b2o2b2o$6b3o2b3o$6b3o2b3o2$6bo6bo$6bo2b2o2bo$7b6o6b2o$18bo2b
o$18b3o$2b2o5b2o5b2o$2bo5bo2bo5bob2o$obo5b4o5bo2bo$2o5b2o2b2o5b2o$4bo
2bo4bo2bo$7bo4bo$8b4o$4bo10bo$5bo8bo2$9b2o!  Almost everything with a tail works, so there's that freedom. The important part is rebuilding the baits. "Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life." -Terry Pratchett gameoflifemaniac Posts: 1196 Joined: January 22nd, 2017, 11:17 am Location: There too ### Re: is this c/10 spaceship known? Nope. Code: Select all x = 20, y = 32, rule = B3/S23 2b2o12b2o$2bo14bo$obo14bobo$2o16b2o8$7b2o2b2o$7b2o2b2o$6b3o2b3o$6b3o2b
3o2$6bo6bo$6bo2b2o2bo$7b6o3$9b2o$8bo2bo$8b4o$7b2o2b2o$4bo2bo4bo2bo$7bo 4bo$8b4o$4bo10bo$5bo8bo2$9b2o!  I was so socially awkward in the past and it will haunt me for the rest of my life. Code: Select all x = 21, y = 5, rule = B3/S23 b2o2bo2b2o2b2o2bobobo$o3bobobobobobobobobo$bo2bobob2o2b2o3bo2bo$2bobob
11b2o6bobo$10bo2bo5bo2bo$2ob2o5b4o6b2o$2ob2o4b2o2b2o$6bo2bo4bo2bo$9bo 4bo$10b4o$6bo10bo$7bo8bo2$11b2o! Iteration of sigma(n)+tau(n)-n [sigma(n)+tau(n)-n : OEIS A163163] (e.g. 16,20,28,34,24,44,46,30,50,49,11,3,3, ...) : 965808 is period 336 (max = 207085118608). towerator Posts: 328 Joined: September 2nd, 2013, 3:03 pm ### Re: is this c/10 spaceship known? A very simple reactionn for a simple fireship to copperhead: Code: Select all x = 11, y = 24, rule = B3/S23 5b2o$3b2o2b2o$5b2o$2bo6bo$3bo4bo$5b2o$2b3o2b3o$2b2o4b2o3$5b2o$4bo2bo2$3bo4bo$2b2o4b2o$bo2bo2bo2bo$b2ob4ob2o$3bo4bo4$b2o$obo$2bo!

Fireship + glider = copperhead + blinker
This is game of life, this is game of life!
Loafin' ships eaten with a knife!

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### Re: is this c/10 spaceship known?

towerator wrote:A very simple reactionn for a simple fireship to copperhead:

Code: Select all

x = 11, y = 24, rule = B3/S23
5b2o$3b2o2b2o$5b2o$2bo6bo$3bo4bo$5b2o$2b3o2b3o$2b2o4b2o3$5b2o$4bo2bo2$
obobobobo2bo$2o3bo2bobobobo2bo2bo!  Sphenocorona Posts: 494 Joined: April 9th, 2013, 11:03 pm ### Re: is this c/10 spaceship known? Well, here's a potential starting bait that should serve as an improvement over the previously shared ones, seeing that it only needs a bi-block and a ship to be reconstructed: Code: Select all x = 21, y = 25, rule = B3/S23 13b2o$12bobo$13bo3$11b2ob2o$11b2ob2o2b2o$2b4o12bobo$19b2o$2bo2bo$bob2o bo$bo4bo2$bo4bo$b2o2b2o$b6o$2bo2bo$3b2o$3b2o2$2o4b2o$2o4b2o$2o4b2o2$2b
o2bo!
The ship itself is only there to convert a rapidly formed blinker into a plume that lends itself more readily to forming a workable output.

EDIT: Actually, don't bother with that last bait, here's an even easier bait with an immediate B output:

Code: Select all

x = 17, y = 18, rule = B3/S23
2b4o6b2o$12b2o$2bo2bo$bob2obo$bo4bo$11b2ob2o$bo4bo4b2ob2o$b2o2b2o$b6o$2bo2bo$3b2o10b2o$3b2o10b2o2$2o4b2o$2o4b2o$2o4b2o2$2bo2bo! Rhombic Posts: 1064 Joined: June 1st, 2013, 5:41 pm ### Re: is this c/10 spaceship known? dvgrn wrote: BlinkerSpawn wrote:Is it possible to do a nondestructive read on a fireship with still lifes? That's what this proof-of-concept pattern was. The question is if it can be done with fewer still lifes, or some constellation that's easier to reconstruct. Clean: Code: Select all x = 24, y = 23, rule = B3/S23 2b2o3b2o$bobo3b2o$bo13b2o2b2o$2o13b2o2b2o$6b2ob2o3b3o2b3o$6b2ob2o3b3o
2b3o2$14bo6bo$14bo2b2o2bo$15b6o3$17b2o$16bo2bo$16b4o$15b2o2b2o$12bo2bo
4bo2bo$15bo4bo$16b4o$12bo10bo$13bo8bo2$17b2o!  towerator wrote:A very simple reactionn for a simple fireship to copperhead: Code: Select all x = 11, y = 24, rule = B3/S23 5b2o$3b2o2b2o$5b2o$2bo6bo$3bo4bo$5b2o$2b3o2b3o$2b2o4b2o3$5b2o$4bo2bo2$3bo4bo$2b2o4b2o$bo2bo2bo2bo$b2ob4ob2o$3bo4bo4$b2o$obo$2bo!

Fireship + glider = copperhead + blinker
Something like that with a reflector&splitter and then this can be timed.
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dvgrn
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### Re: is this c/10 spaceship known?

Rhombic wrote:Clean:

Code: Select all

x = 24, y = 23, rule = B3/S23
2b2o3b2o$bobo3b2o$bo13b2o2b2o$2o13b2o2b2o$6b2ob2o3b3o2b3o$6b2ob2o3b3o 2b3o2$14bo6bo$14bo2b2o2bo$15b6o3$17b2o$16bo2bo$16b4o$15b2o2b2o$12bo2bo 4bo2bo$15bo4bo$16b4o$12bo10bo$13bo8bo2$17b2o!
That's certainly workable, with a slow-salvo reconstruction if nothing else. It would be nice if the output glider didn't have to cross the fireship lane, but actually that has advantages for rebuilding a bi-block in that orientation, using two synchronized gliders not a slow salvo.
Rhombic wrote:
towerator wrote:A very simple reaction for a simple fireship to copperhead:

Code: Select all

x = 11, y = 24, rule = B3/S23
5b2o$3b2o2b2o$5b2o$2bo6bo$3bo4bo$5b2o$2b3o2b3o$2b2o4b2o3$5b2o$4bo2bo2$
3bo4bo$2b2o4b2o$bo2bo2bo2bo$b2ob4ob2o$3bo4bo4$b2o$obo$2bo!  Fireship + glider = copperhead + blinker Something like that with a reflector&splitter and then this can be timed. People seem to be missing the clean conversion of glider_rider's that gameoflifemaniac pointed out at the top of this page, that started this whole conversation. Yes, once we have an output signal, timing that glider will be trivial. Rebuilding the bait is the painful part, so it's worth investing some time making sure that the bait is really minimal. Extrementhusiast Posts: 1849 Joined: June 16th, 2009, 11:24 pm Location: USA ### Re: is this c/10 spaceship known? This one isn't too bad, I guess: Code: Select all x = 20, y = 21, rule = B3/S23 11b2o2b2o$11b2o2b2o$10b3o2b3o$10b3o2b3o$3b2o$3b2o5bo6bo$10bo2b2o2bo$
11b6o3$o12b2o$3o9bo2bo$3bob2o5b4o$2b2ob2o4b2o2b2o$8bo2bo4bo2bo$11bo4bo
$12b4o$8bo10bo$9bo8bo2$13b2o!

Shame it couldn't have been an integral, though.
I Like My Heisenburps! (and others)

dvgrn
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### Re: is this c/10 spaceship known?

Extrementhusiast wrote:This one isn't too bad, I guess...
Really that's about as good a bait as we can reasonably hope for. Six gliders could reconstitute it -- or five synchronized gliders plus a cleanup, if the catalyst block is taken out (it barely gets in the way of the cheap eater synthesis).

Code: Select all

x = 63, y = 82, rule = LifeHistory
61.A$60.A$60.3A21$25.A.A$25.2A$26.A2$12.A$13.2A$12.2A2$16.C$15.C.C$15.C.C$12.D3.C$12.3D$15.D.2D$14.2D.2D12$27.3A$27.A$28.A5$2A42.2A$.2A
41.A.A$A43.A3$23.2A2.2A$23.2A2.2A$22.3A2.3A$22.3A2.3A2$22.A6.A$22.A2. 2A2.A$23.6A3$25.2A$24.A2.A$24.4A$23.2A2.2A$20.A2.A4.A2.A$23.A4.A$24. 4A$20.A10.A$21.A8.A2$25.2A!
#C [[ STEP 5 STOP 450 ]]
I don't have the tools to figure out quickly what the shortest slow-salvo-ish reconstitution of the bait would be, with gliders all coming from the same side that the output goes to. It's probably long enough to have a worse repeat time than this five-synchronized-glider recipe, even given the various gliders that will have to cross the fireship lane.

The fastest possible repeat time would no doubt involve some kind of horrible multi-stage recovery system. One-time turners and splitters would be arranged to reconstruct the bait as quickly as possible, while at the same time a huge and awkward pile of circuitry is started up, to rebuild the various turners and splitters.

... Ugh. It still won't be either fast or elegant. So at the moment I'm not tempted to try and minimize the repeat time. Maybe minimize the Heisenburp detector bounding box, and not worry about repeat time. How often do you really see a close-packed stream of fireships going by, anyway?

Sphenocorona
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### Re: is this c/10 spaceship known?

dvgrn wrote:Really that's about as good a bait as we can reasonably hope for.
Hmm... Yeah, I suppose so. I mean, I found this, but the bottom eater is unfortunately in such a position as to prevent a 5 glider total restoration:

Code: Select all

x = 32, y = 26, rule = B3/S23
30b2o$13b2o15bo$12bobo13bobo$13bo14b2o3$11b2ob2o$11b2ob2o2b2o$2b4o12bo
bo$19b2o$2bo2bo$bob2obo$bo4bo2$bo4bo$b2o2b2o$b6o$2bo2bo$3b2o$3b2o$23b 2o$2o4b2o15bo$2o4b2o16b3o$2o4b2o18bo2$2bo2bo!  There might be some way of extracting a glider in a less intrusive manner still, but the block on eater bait still looks like a good contender. A for awesome Posts: 2098 Joined: September 13th, 2014, 5:36 pm Location: Pembina University, Home of the Gliders Contact: ### Re: is this c/10 spaceship known? I think it's worth mentioning these two additional ways for two fireships to pull a block: Code: Select all x = 26, y = 50, rule = B3/S23 4b2o14b2o$3bo2bo13b2o$2b2o2b2o11bo2bo$2b2o2b2o11b4o$2bob2obo10bob2obo$
4b2o13bo2bo$2bo4bo$b2o4b2o9b2o2b2o$17bo6bo2$4b2o12bo4bo$3bo2bo12bo2bo$
3bo2bo13b2o2$b2o4b2o8b2o4b2o$o2bo2bo2bo6bo2bo2bo2bo$o2bo2bo2bo7b2o4b2o$bobo2bobo9bo4bo$12b2o$12b2o7$4b2o$3bo2bo$2b2o2b2o$2b2o2b2o$2bob2obo$
4b2o$2bo4bo12b2o$b2o4b2o11b2o$19bo2bo$19b4o$4b2o12bob2obo$3bo2bo12bo2b
o$3bo2bo$18b2o2b2o$b2o4b2o8bo6bo$o2bo2bo2bo$o2bo2bo2bo8bo4bo$bobo2bobo
10bo2bo$12b2o6b2o$12b2o$17b2o4b2o$16bo2bo2bo2bo$17b2o4b2o$18bo4bo!

praosylen#5847 (Discord)

x₁=ηx
V*_η=c²√(Λη)
K=(Λu²)/2
Pₐ=1−1/(∫^∞_t₀(p(t)ˡ⁽ᵗ⁾)dt)

$$x_1=\eta x$$
$$V^*_\eta=c^2\sqrt{\Lambda\eta}$$
$$K=\frac{\Lambda u^2}2$$
$$P_a=1-\frac1{\int^\infty_{t_0}p(t)^{l(t)}dt}$$

Ethanagor
Posts: 80
Joined: March 15th, 2017, 7:34 pm
Location: the Milky Way galaxy

### Re: is this c/10 spaceship known?

Is this useful?

Code: Select all

x = 20, y = 21, rule = Life
4.A2.A$4.A2.A$3.A4.A$3.A4.A$3.A4.A$3.A4.A$2.3A2.3A$2.A.4A.A$3.A4.A2$19.A$5.2A10.3A$5.2A6.2A.A$5.2A6.2A.2A$3.A4.A$.3A4.3A$3A6.3A$2A8.2A$. 10A$2.8A$4.4A!  Edit: Here's a proof-of-concept for if anyone can find a cheaper block-producing reaction: Code: Select all x = 53, y = 27, rule = LifeHistory 4.A2BA$4.A2BA$3.A4BA16.BABA2B$3.A4BA9.B4.3BA2BA3B$2.BA4BAB7.2AB.8B2A 4B2.B.A5B$2.BA4BAB7.2A8BA3B2A5BABA6B4.B$2.3A2B3A8.4B2A5B2A2B.3BAB2A8B .B2A$.BAB4ABAB7.3BA4BA2BA6B2AB2A10B2A$.2BA4BA2B9.B4.BABA8BAB2A11B$.
10B19.8BABA11B$.10B18.A6B3.A5B4.B$.4B2A4B7.2C8.A3B$.4B2A4B3.C3.2C7.B 3A$.4B2A4B2.C.C10.4B$.2BA4BA2B3.2C9.4B$.3A4B3A13.4B$3A6B3A2.2C7.4B$2A
8B2A3.C6.4B$B10AB2.C6.A3B$2B8A2B2.2C4.BABA$4B4A4B9.2A3.B$12B9.3B.B2C$12B10.C3B2C$12B9.C.CB.B$12B8.C.CB$12B8.C$12B7.2C!  Edit 2: adding one block to the first pattern can eliminate the bee hive for free: Code: Select all x = 20, y = 21, rule = LifeHistory 4.A2.A$4.A2.A$3.A4.A$3.A4.A$3.A4.A6.2A$3.A4.A6.2A$2.3A2.3A$2.A.4A.A$3.A4.A2$19.A$5.2A10.3A$5.2A6.2A.A$5.2A6.2A.2A$3.A4.A$.3A4.3A$3A6.3A$2A8.2A$.10A$2.8A$4.4A!

"It's not easy having a good time. Even smiling makes my face ache." - Frank N. Furter

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### Re: is this c/10 spaceship known?

Ethanagor wrote:Is this useful?

Code: Select all

x = 20, y = 21, rule = LifeHistory
4.A2.A$4.A2.A$3.A4.A$3.A4.A$3.A4.A6.2A$3.A4.A6.2A$2.3A2.3A$2.A.4A.A$
3.A4.A2$19.A$5.2A10.3A$5.2A6.2A.A$5.2A6.2A.2A$3.A4.A$.3A4.3A$3A6.3A$
2A8.2A$.10A$2.8A$4.4A!  Extrementhusiast, two weeks ago wrote: Code: Select all x = 20, y = 21, rule = B3/S23 11b2o2b2o$11b2o2b2o$10b3o2b3o$10b3o2b3o$3b2o$3b2o5bo6bo$10bo2b2o2bo$
11b6o3$o12b2o$3o9bo2bo$3bob2o5b4o$2b2ob2o4b2o2b2o$8bo2bo4bo2bo$11bo4bo
$12b4o$8bo10bo$9bo8bo2$13b2o!

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dvgrn
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### Re: is this c/10 spaceship known?

Ethanagor wrote:Is this useful?
Edit 2: adding one block to the first pattern can eliminate the bee hive for free...
Yes, as Blinkerspawn pointed out, that's the reaction from three posts up that allows a rebuild with a couple of pairs of synchronized gliders, plus a cleanup. The block is a good trick but as far as I could see, it ends up just getting in the way and doesn't save anything on the total complexity.
Ethanagor wrote:Edit: Here's a proof-of-concept for if anyone can find a cheaper block-producing reaction...
The p30 glider gun testing for the presence of a block is a good idea, but it limits the timing of the fireships that can go past:

Code: Select all

#C sample non-working phase of test pattern
x = 53, y = 27, rule = LifeHistory
4.A2BA17.BABA2B$4.A2BA10.B4.3BA2BA3B$3.A4BA8.2AB.8B2A4B2.B.A5B$3.A4BA 8.2A8BA3B2A5BABA6B4.B$2.BA4BAB8.4B2A5B2A2B.3BAB2A8B.B2A$2.BA4BAB8.3BA 4BA2BA6B2AB2A10B2A$2.3A2B3A10.B4.BABA8BAB2A11B$.BAB4ABAB19.8BABA11B$.
2BA4BA2B18.A6B3.A5B4.B$.10B7.2C8.A3B$.10B3.C3.2C7.B3A$.4B2A4B2.C.C10. 4B$.4B2A4B3.2C9.4B$.4B2A4B13.4B$.2BA4BA2B3.2C7.4B$.3A4B3A4.C6.4B$3A6B
3A2.C6.A3B$2A8B2A2.2C4.BABA$B10AB9.2A3.B$2B8A2B9.3B.B2C$4B4A4B10.C3B
2C$12B9.C.CB.B$12B8.C.CB$12B8.C$12B7.2C$12B$12B!
If we're going to limit the passing fireships to specific phases mod 30, I suspect it will turn out to be possible to come up with a nice clean detector that tests for the presence of the fireship sparks. Set up a vanish reaction near the fireship lane, let's say, and arrange it so the fireship turns the dying spark into a glider. No need to rebuild any expensive still lifes that way.