Create your own terminology

For general discussion about Conway's Game of Life.
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confocaloid
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Re: Create your own terminology

Post by confocaloid » May 2nd, 2024, 11:59 pm

eRroR_6o6 wrote:
May 2nd, 2024, 11:06 pm
Pseudo-phoenix: Every cell in the rotor dies after 1 generation.

Examples:every p2, tubber, and hustler (there are probably more)
Oscillators without any survival events in the rotor:
confocaloid wrote:
February 6th, 2024, 12:22 pm
What is the highest period with a known oscillator without any survival events in the rotor? In other words, if an alive cell survives to the next phase then it must belong to the stator.
I found only few known p3 and p4 examples (edit 6: added more examples, including a p6). Are there higher-period examples?

Code: Select all

x = 115, y = 69, rule = B3/S23
60bobo$44b2o13bob2o14bobo$44b2o11b3o11b2o2b3ob3o2b2o6b2o$obobo10bo40bo
4b2o8bo2bo7bo2bo7bo$15b3o24b4o10bo2b2o2bob2o5bobo2b3o2bobo8bob2o$4bo
13bo10b2o8bobo4bo8b2obo4bobo5b2obo3bo3bob2o4b2obob2o$17bo3b2o6bo3b2o4b
2obo3bo7bo3bo3bo3bo8b2o3b2o8b2ob2o$obobo12bo4bo11bo7bo3bob2o5bobo4bob
2o11b3o13bo$18b4o5b7o8bo4bobo4b2obo2b2o2bo10b2o3b2o8b2obo$4bo22bo15b4o
11b2o4bo6b2obo3bo3bob2o4b2obo2bo$20b2o8b2o29b3o8bobo2b3o2bobo8bob2o$ob
obo15b2o8b2o11b2o13b2obo9bo2bo7bo2bo7bo$43b2o13bobo10b2o2b3ob3o2b2o6b
2o$77bobo10$o3bo11b2o5bo2b2o5b2o19b2o17b2o8bo3b2o10b2o9b2o$16bo5bobo2b
o5bobo14b2o3bo18bo7bobo2bo12bo5b2obo2bo$o3bo13bo3bob2o9bo2b2o9bo2bo2bo
b2o10bo2bo8bo2bo3bo8b3o3bobobobo2bo$17b2o2b2o11b2obo2bo9b2obobo2bo8b3o
2b2o6bo4b3o2b2o4bobo4bo4b2o2bobo$obobo18b3o11bo2bo12b2obo9bo7bo6b2o5b
2obo4bobo4bo3b2o4b2o$15b3o2b2obo2bo11b2ob2obo9b2ob4o4bo2b2ob2o2bo7bo2b
obo8b3o7b2o$4bo10bo2bob2o4bo8b2ob2obob2o6b2ob2obo2bo5b2o2b2ob2o8bobobo
b2o10b4o6bo$16bob2o2b2o2bob2o6bo15bo14bo2bo2bo6b2obo2b2o3bo5b2o2b2o5bo
2bo$4bo12bo2bo3b2o2bo7bo3bo11bobo12bobobobo6bobob2o4bo6bobo5bobobo2bo$
18b2o2b3o3bo6b2obobo10b2obobo11b2ob2o11bobo2bo15bo$22bo2b3o6bo2b2ob3o
7bo2b2ob3o24bo2bobo9bo2bobo2bo4bobo$18b3obo11b2o7bo6b2o7bo23b2o2bo11bo
2bo5b2o2b2o$17bo3bob3o16b2o14b2o39bo6b4o$17b2o2bo3bo76b2o7b3o$19bobo
47b2o25b2o4b2o3bo4bobo$19b2o44b2obo2bo24bobo2b2o4bo4bobo$65bo3bo2bo25b
o2bobobobo3b3o$66b3o4bo24bo2bob2o5bo$68bob2obo25b2o9b2o$70b2ob2o$obobo
17b2o46bo2bo$22bo46bobobo$o22bo3b2o38b3ob2o$22b2o2bobo37bo$obobo10b2o
4bo2b3o2b2o35b2o$15bobo2bob2o3b2o2bo$o3bo12bo2bobo2b2o2b2o2b2o$15bobo
2b3o2bobo3b2o2bo$obobo10b2o4b2o2b2o2b2o2b2o2b2o$20bo3b3o2bobo3b2o2bo7b
o19b2ob2o2b2o$19bob2obo3bobo2b2o2b2o2b2o3bobo18b2obo2bo2bo$19bo2bo2b2o
2b2o2bobo3b2o2bo2bobo21bob2obo2b2o$20bo2b2o2b2o3bobo2b2o2b2o2b2o2b2o
16b2o2bo3b3o2bo4b2o$21b2o2b2o2b2o2b2o2bobo3b2o2b2o2bo14bo2b2o2b2o3b2ob
o2bobo$23bobo2bo2b2o3bobo2b2o2b2o2bo2bo12bo2bo2b2o2b2o2bobo2bo$23bobo
3b2o2b2o2b2o2bobo3bob2obo12bob2obo3bobo2b3o2bobo$24bo7bo2b2o3bobo2b3o
3bo14bo3b3o2b2o2b2o4b2o$33b2o2b2o2b2o2b2o2b2o4b2o4b2o4b2o2b2o2b3o3bo$
36bo2b2o3bobo2b3o2bobo4bobo2b3o2bobo3bob2obo$37b2o2b2o2b2o2bobo2bo8bo
2bobo2b2o2b2o2bo2bo$40bo2b2o3b2obo2bobo4bobo2bob2o3b2o2b2o2bo$41b2o2b
3o2bo4b2o4b2o4bo2b3o3bo2b2o$43bobo2b2o18b2o2bob2obo$43b2o3bo22bo2bo2bo
b2o$49bo22b2o2b2ob2o$48b2o!
#C [[ THEME Generations ]]
Edit: the following oscillators are "nearest failed examples" I found, which have relatively few survival events in the rotor: Edit 4: here is a known p6 oscillator, which does not have survival events in the rotor:

Code: Select all

x = 30, y = 20, rule = B3/S23
21b2o$22bo$16b2o3bo$9bo6bobo2b2o$8bobo3b2o2b3o2bo4b2o$8bobo2bo2b2o3b2o
bo2bobo$6b2o2b2o2b2o2b2o2bobo2bo$5bo2b2o2b2o3bobo2b3o2bobo$4bo2bo2b2o
2b2o2b2o2b2o4b2o$4bob2obo3bobo2b3o3bo$5bo3b3o2bobo3bob2obo$2o4b2o2b2o
2b2o2b2o2bo2bo$obo2b3o2bobo3b2o2b2o2bo$2bo2bobo2b2o2b2o2b2o2b2o$obo2bo
b2o3b2o2bo2bobo$2o4bo2b3o2b2o3bobo$7b2o2bobo6bo$8bo3b2o$7bo$7b2o!
#C [[ THEME Generations ]]
Further relaxed, to require only that there must be at least one phase without any old cells in the rotor: viewtopic.php?p=177549#p177549
127:1 B3/S234c User:Confocal/R (isotropic CA, incomplete)
Unlikely events happen.
My silence does not imply agreement, nor indifference. If I disagreed with something in the past, then please do not construe my silence as something that could change that.

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tommyaweosme
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Re: Create your own terminology

Post by tommyaweosme » June 2nd, 2024, 8:31 pm

5m,4m ravenship
5m,3m robinship
5m,2m storkship
6m,5m alpacaship
7m,6m galaxyship
7m,5m sunship
7m,4m planetship
7m,3m cloudship
7m,2m skyship
7m,m rainbowship
23m,5m waterbear
23m,4m firebear
23m,3m airbear
23m,2m earthbear
23m,1m bearship

(i know this isnt fairy chess but i found opportunities and filled them in)
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AlbertArmStain
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Re: Create your own terminology

Post by AlbertArmStain » June 11th, 2024, 9:20 pm

AlbertArmStain wrote:
August 21st, 2023, 10:30 am
Universal construction based replicators can be divided in to two classes, each with their own sub classes. The two classes of replicators are "tape based replicators" and "channel construction replicators". The sub classes for "tape based replicators" are "stable tape replicators" (e.g. William R. Buckley's replicators, NP-replicator, anything that has a static tape), and "moving tape replicators" (e.g. JVN loop replicator, rct (although I don't think the rct counts). The subclass for "channel construction replicators" are "single channel construction replicators" (e.g DOGun SaGaQR, 0E0P metacell(?)) and "multiple channel construction replicators" (e.g. Linear propagator). Additionally, replicators can be linear, super-linear, or quadratic.
Building off of this idea, the term "single channel construction replicators" can be shortened to "serial replicators" and "multiple channel construction replicators" can be shortened to "parallel replicators". Both of these are named after data transmission methods. Similarly, the term "tape based replicators" can be referred to "static replicators" but calling "moving tape replicators" "dynamic replicators" doesn’t make as much sense.

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Re: Create your own terminology

Post by tommyaweosme » June 11th, 2024, 10:44 pm

following the recent condition-transition war, i will now make new terminology away from those gross words:

stuff - the stuff in neighborhood
way - what happens because of stuff

hensel table has stuff

"stuff rules" and "way rules" dont make sense. its just "rule".

there is bways and sways. there is no bstuff and sstuff.

there are no ways on the hensel table.
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confocaloid
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Re: Create your own terminology

Post by confocaloid » June 12th, 2024, 6:11 am

tommyaweosme wrote:
June 11th, 2024, 10:44 pm
[...] new terminology away from [...]
I think that's misunderstanding of the topic. It's not really about "this word vs. that word". Instead, the topic is about the underlying concepts, and about intuitively clear/suggestive ways to refer to those specific underlying concepts.

What each word/phrase suggests intuitively to an "interested but not invested" wiki reader?

It seems helpful to use the word 'condition' to refer to a condition on the current states of some cells. To specify a condition, one needs to tell some information about states of cells in the current generation.
"The cell is currently alive and has at least four alive neighbours" is a condition.
"The cell is currently dead" is a condition.
"The cell currently has no alive neighbours" is a condition.

It seems helpful to use the word 'transition' to refer to a state-to-state transition, when some state-X cell transitions into a state-Y cell.
"The cell is born", "the cell survives", "the cell remains dead", "the cell dies" are examples for two-state CA.

It seems helpful to use the phrase 'transition rule' to refer to a rule that dictates a certain condition under which a certain transition will happen.
An example of a transition rule is "If the cell is currently alive and has at least four alive neighbours, then the cell will die".

(Note that neither of the above words/phrases is recently invented, and neither is invented on these forums. This terminology and these concepts existed for many years in the Life/CA community.)

Why all of the above seems helpful? Because that wording agrees with common-sense intuition, and because that wording suggests the correct overall picture of the underlying ideas and the relationships between those underlying ideas. A rule prescribes; a transition happens; a condition is checked/tested when deciding whether or not a transition will happen.

In contrast, the words 'stuff' and 'way' you propose seem too vague in comparison, and do not provide any intuitively clear picture.
For example, if I say or write something like "B3 stuff" or "B3 way", I'm pretty sure nobody will understand what I mean by that, unless and until they go and read the written definitions.

If you write "the B3 condition" (e.g. when discussing Life-like cellular automata) it's pretty clear that you mean a condition; conditions don't tell the future. In this case, the condition tells "the cell is currently dead and has exactly three alive neighbours".
If you write "the B3 transition rule" (e.g. when discussing Life-like cellular automata) it's pretty clear that you mean a transition rule. In this case, the transition rule tells "if the cell is currently dead and has exactly three alive neighbours then the cell is born in the next generation".
Last edited by confocaloid on June 12th, 2024, 8:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Unlikely events happen.
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Mathemagician314
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Re: Create your own terminology

Post by Mathemagician314 » June 12th, 2024, 7:13 am

A rake that shoots spaceships in all directions: omnirake
Can we make a (28,3)c/84 spaceship??

Code: Select all

x = 3, y = 4, rule = B3-e4i5-a/S2-i3-a4cr5e6c
o$obo$b2o$2o!
[[ THEME PCA ]]

Code: Select all

x = 6, y = 5, rule = 2-ak34/2kn3-r4aijnr5c/5
.3A$.ABA$DAD2A$.ABADC$.3A2B!
[[ THEME BLUES ]]
[currently inactive]

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Re: Create your own terminology

Post by tommyaweosme » June 12th, 2024, 9:04 am

that would be an omnibreeder or an omnipuffer because of all the glider collisions.
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Re: Create your own terminology

Post by b-engine » June 12th, 2024, 5:52 pm

tommyaweosme wrote:
June 12th, 2024, 9:04 am
that would be an omnibreeder or an omnipuffer because of all the glider collisions.
Won't, as the spaceships produced never collides, else the omnirake will break down. 2G collisions can't produce a puffer, too.
EDIT:
In response to confocaloid's opinion, I think an omnirake could be required tl shoot only 4 or 8 spaceships.
Last edited by b-engine on June 12th, 2024, 6:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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confocaloid
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Re: Create your own terminology

Post by confocaloid » June 12th, 2024, 6:02 pm

Mathemagician314 wrote:
June 12th, 2024, 7:13 am
A rake that shoots spaceships in all directions: omnirake
I can imagine a "rake" that would shoot engineered spaceships with infinitely many distinct directions. Construct an oblique spaceship with direction (n, 1); move away by some fixed displacement and increment n; repeat forever. Incrementing n means that even if the output is ignored, the "rake" would never repeat twice.

edit:

One possible different definition would be:
"a rake that shoots spaceships of some types in all directions that are possible for spaceships of those types"
In that case, if all escaping spaceships are gliders from CGoL (xq4_153), then the rake must send them in four directions (NW, NE, SW, SE).
If it's a rake in LeapLife that shoots some gliders and some lepas (and possibly other spaceships), that would imply some knightship must be sent in each of 8 possible knightwise directions, and some diagonal spaceship must be sent in each of 4 diagonal directions.

Another possible definition would be
"a rake that shoots spaceships of some types, sending a spaceship of every type in all directions possible for spaceships of that type"
In that case, if it's a rake in LeapLife that shoots some xq4_153 gliders and some lepas (and possibly other spaceships), that would imply a lepa must be sent in each of 8 possible knightwise directions, and a xq4_153 glider must be sent in each of 4 diagonal directions.

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Re: Create your own terminology

Post by tommyaweosme » June 14th, 2024, 8:59 am

we should redefine when a soup settles when it goes to a same state it did before (except for spaceships and stuff), so the highest lifespan on torus problem could have been solved by my answer
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Re: Create your own terminology

Post by confocaloid » June 14th, 2024, 9:23 am

tommyaweosme wrote:
June 14th, 2024, 8:59 am
we should redefine when a soup settles when it goes to a same state it did before (except for spaceships and stuff), [...]
The part "and stuff" is vague, and excluding spaceships feels artificial. Why not simply wait for the first generation that can be decomposed into still lives, phases of oscillators and/or phases of spaceships that will never interact with each other?
If the initial generation (the soup) is T = 0 and the final generation (with the described property) is T = n, then the lifespan of the soup equals n ticks.

One would need some adjustments and clarifications, to be able to unambiguously define lifespans for predictable infinite growths. But the complexity of that puzzle does not rely on whether or not one requires some state to repeat twice in some sense.
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Re: Create your own terminology

Post by tommyaweosme » June 14th, 2024, 9:55 am

infinite growth (breeders) doesnt settle
rakes and puffers do
so do spaceships
all once they have went through one full cycle and everything else in the life universe has
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Re: Create your own terminology

Post by tommyaweosme » June 14th, 2024, 12:25 pm

ok here:
blinkers have 2 lifespan
gliders have 4 lifespan
space rakes have 20 lifespan
pulsars have 3 lifespan
a pulsar next to a blinker where they dont interacts have 6 lifespan
etc. etc.
this soup

Code: Select all

r=B3/S23
b3ob5o$bobo2bob3o$2o2b2ob3o$b4o2bo2bo$bo2bobo2bo$b3o5b2o$bobo2bo3bo$o
2bob5o$4o2b4o$4bo3bobo$2o2b3ob3o!
has a lifespan of 55
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confocaloid
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Re: Create your own terminology

Post by confocaloid » June 14th, 2024, 12:38 pm

tommyaweosme wrote:
June 14th, 2024, 12:25 pm
ok here:
blinkers have 2 lifespan
gliders have 4 lifespan
space rakes have 20 lifespan
pulsars have 3 lifespan
a pulsar next to a blinker where they dont interacts have 6 lifespan
etc. etc. [...]
I think it's simpler to view each of those patterns as a pattern with lifespan 0. In other words, those patterns are already settled in the initial generation.

The blinker is a period-2 oscillator; the pulsar is a period-3 oscillator; a pulsar next to a blinker (where they don't interact) is a (trivial) period-6 oscillator.
The glider is a period-4 diagonal c/4 spaceship.
The space rake is a period-20 orthogonal c/2 rake emitting forward gliders.
tommyaweosme wrote:
June 14th, 2024, 12:25 pm
[...] this soup

Code: Select all

r=B3/S23
b3ob5o$bobo2bob3o$2o2b2ob3o$b4o2bo2bo$bo2bobo2bo$b3o5b2o$bobo2bo3bo$o
2bob5o$4o2b4o$4bo3bobo$2o2b3ob3o!
has a lifespan of 55
You're using an unsupported pattern format that can't be easily viewed in Golly/LifeViewer. Here is what is probably the same pattern, copied from Golly and pasted unchanged:

Code: Select all

x = 11, y = 11, rule = B3/S23
b3ob5o$bobo2bob3o$2o2b2ob3o$b4o2bo2bo$bo2bobo2bo$b3o5b2o$bobo2bo3bo$o
2bob5o$4o2b4o$4bo3bobo$2o2b3ob3o!
This pattern has lifespan 53, and settles into a stationary constellation (a beehive, a block and a traffic light) without any escaping moving objects. The final pattern has period 2.
127:1 B3/S234c User:Confocal/R (isotropic CA, incomplete)
Unlikely events happen.
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Re: Create your own terminology

Post by tommyaweosme » June 14th, 2024, 3:14 pm

(i really want to win highest lifespan on tori b3/s23 by placing a really high period glider tracks with lcm)
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confocaloid
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Re: Create your own terminology

Post by confocaloid » June 18th, 2024, 10:00 am

SKROP(n): smallest known real oscillator of period n.
Context: https://conwaylife.com/w/index.php?diff ... did=149434

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