## apgsearch v1.0

For general discussion about Conway's Game of Life.
Apple Bottom
Posts: 1034
Joined: July 27th, 2015, 2:06 pm
Contact:

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

calcyman wrote:1. I have no idea. A haul can't exceed one megabyte in size, though.
Is there a way to have larger hauls committed manually, or submit them in chunks? I was investigating a rather productive rule (B45S1234/D8_1), and when I ended the search after ~400k soups the haul had already ballooned to about 3.5 MiB. (I could've sworn I asked for 100,000 soups - and yes, I edited the script to change the minimum first -, but maybe I mistyped. Hooves, wouldn't ya know.)

It would be a shame to see this haul go to waste.
If you speak, your speech must be better than your silence would have been. — Arabian proverb

Catagolue: Apple Bottom • Life Wiki: Apple Bottom • Twitter: @_AppleBottom_

Proud member of the Pattern Raiders!

A for awesome
Posts: 2096
Joined: September 13th, 2014, 5:36 pm
Location: Pembina University, Home of the Gliders
Contact:

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

Could someone explain how the rules used in the censusing process work? I figured out CoalesceObjects, ClassifyObjects, and ExpungeObjects, but the rest (in particular ContagiousLife) are confusing to me.
praosylen#5847 (Discord)

x₁=ηx
V*_η=c²√(Λη)
K=(Λu²)/2
Pₐ=1−1/(∫^∞_t₀(p(t)ˡ⁽ᵗ⁾)dt)

$$x_1=\eta x$$
$$V^*_\eta=c^2\sqrt{\Lambda\eta}$$
$$K=\frac{\Lambda u^2}2$$
$$P_a=1-\frac1{\int^\infty_{t_0}p(t)^{l(t)}dt}$$

Extrementhusiast
Posts: 1849
Joined: June 16th, 2009, 11:24 pm
Location: USA

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

A for awesome wrote:Could someone explain how the rules used in the censusing process work? I figured out CoalesceObjects, ClassifyObjects, and ExpungeObjects, but the rest (in particular ContagiousLife) are confusing to me.
From what I can tell, ContagiousLife is used to separate objects from each other, but not in such a way that an unstable object remains. (e.g. a block on table will be registered as a block on table rather than as a table and block separately, as the table alone is not stable)
I Like My Heisenburps! (and others)

Apple Bottom
Posts: 1034
Joined: July 27th, 2015, 2:06 pm
Contact:

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

I'm sure I'm just missing the bleedin' obvious, but I'm puzzled: this haul counts 1 PATHOLOGICAL object, but offers two (different) sample soups.

Shouldn't it be reporting 2 PATHOLOGICALs?
If you speak, your speech must be better than your silence would have been. — Arabian proverb

Catagolue: Apple Bottom • Life Wiki: Apple Bottom • Twitter: @_AppleBottom_

Proud member of the Pattern Raiders!

Saka
Posts: 3550
Joined: June 19th, 2015, 8:50 pm
Location: In the kingdom of Sultan Hamengkubuwono X
Contact:

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

Apple Bottom wrote:I'm sure I'm just missing the bleedin' obvious, but I'm puzzled: this haul counts 1 PATHOLOGICAL object, but offers two (different) sample soups.

Shouldn't it be reporting 2 PATHOLOGICALs?
Not sure what you mean, but I think that the same PATHOLOGICAL occured in two soups, but the strangest thing that it said 1 occurrence but displays 2 soups from the haul, I don't know what's going on though.¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Code: Select all

o3b2ob2obo3b2o2b2o$bo3b2obob3o3bo2bo$2bo2b3o5b3ob4o$3o3bo2bo2b3o3b3o$
4bo4bobo4bo$2o2b2o2b4obo2bo3bo$2ob4o3bo2bo2bo2bo$b2o3bobob2o$3bobobo5b
obobobo\$3bobobob2o3bo2bobo!

(Check gen 3)

Scorbie
Posts: 1464
Joined: December 7th, 2013, 1:05 am

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

I think apgsearch does not distinguish between pathological objects. Even if you find two soups producing pathological objects A and B, it can't further label it with an apgcode, I think. And I think it's the same for the zz_LINEAR and zz_REPLICATOR objects, isn't it? Even if there are more than one replicator in a rule, apgsearch would not distinguish them.
A side effect of this is that on Catagolue, PATHOLOGICAL contains pathological objects with all rules.
Best wishes to you, Scorbie

wildmyron
Posts: 1444
Joined: August 9th, 2013, 12:45 am

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

Scorbie is right - each soup with an unidentifiable pattern is scored separately with no attempt to compare them. I suspect apgsearch could report more pathological patterns than soups (though I haven't double checked to see if this is the case) but it shouldn't report more sample soups than the number of pathological patterns found. Strangely enough, most of the other 1000000 soup hauls don't have any soups detected as pathological, but this one has seven sample soups for a total of 5.
The latest version of the 5S Project contains over 226,000 spaceships. There is also a GitHub mirror of the collection. Tabulated pages up to period 160 (out of date) are available on the LifeWiki.

Apple Bottom
Posts: 1034
Joined: July 27th, 2015, 2:06 pm
Contact:

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

All y'all raise good points, and I do apologize for the confusion.

What I meant was this: if a pathological object occurred twice, for two different soups, why is the total number of pathological objects reported by apgsearch one, rather than two?

This also happened in other hauls for this rule. This one counts one occurrence of a pathological object, but reports four sample soups. This one counts five occurrences but reports eight sample soups. And so on.

I can understand there not being a sample soup for every occurrence of an object, but if there's more soups than occurrences, then my hunch is that apgsearch isn't counting properly. But that can't really be, now can it? So what's going on here?
If you speak, your speech must be better than your silence would have been. — Arabian proverb

Catagolue: Apple Bottom • Life Wiki: Apple Bottom • Twitter: @_AppleBottom_

Proud member of the Pattern Raiders!

drc
Posts: 1664
Joined: December 3rd, 2015, 4:11 pm
Location: creating useless things in OCA

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

Whenever I enter a rule, it seems to revert to B3/S23
Edit: Closing and restarting fixes it, but still annoying.
\100\97\110\105

drc
Posts: 1664
Joined: December 3rd, 2015, 4:11 pm
Location: creating useless things in OCA

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

Never mind, still happening. Shame
\100\97\110\105

velcrorex
Posts: 339
Joined: November 1st, 2009, 1:33 pm

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

drc wrote:Whenever I enter a rule, it seems to revert to B3/S23.
When you run apgsearch it sometimes first does some work verifying some soups in B3/S23. Then after a short time it will start the work you asked it to. This could be what you're seeing.
-Josh Ball.

Apple Bottom
Posts: 1034
Joined: July 27th, 2015, 2:06 pm
Contact:

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

I'm posting this here since there's no dedicated Catagolue thread (there isn't, is there?), and since it's not specifically about apg* 2.x or 3.x.

Certain links don't work and cause internal server errors, e.g. this haul link: https://catagolue.appspot.com/haul/b2-a ... e644c3ce9b

My uneducated guess is that the server code's running into a resource limit of some kind, and that this is due to the large number of high-period (xq40) spaceship flotillas in this rule that have to be rendered as animated SVGs.
If you speak, your speech must be better than your silence would have been. — Arabian proverb

Catagolue: Apple Bottom • Life Wiki: Apple Bottom • Twitter: @_AppleBottom_

Proud member of the Pattern Raiders!

muzik
Posts: 3910
Joined: January 28th, 2016, 2:47 pm
Location: Scotland

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

Behold, one of the cringiest questions ever, from someone who's supposed to be good with computers:

How do I run this?

I've downloaded the latest version of Python and the apgsearch py file, and I have golly, but when I try to double click on the apgsearch py file it shows a black box for a fraction of a second before just vanishing for no reason.
Bored of using the Moore neighbourhood for everything? Introducing the Range-2 von Neumann isotropic non-totalistic rulespace!

Kazyan
Posts: 1001
Joined: February 6th, 2014, 11:02 pm

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

muzik wrote:Behold, one of the cringiest questions ever, from someone who's supposed to be good with computers:

How do I run this?

I've downloaded the latest version of Python and the apgsearch py file, and I have golly, but when I try to double click on the apgsearch py file it shows a black box for a fraction of a second before just vanishing for no reason.
Add apgsearch.py to Golly's Scripts folder, then double-click the file from within Golly, instead of your file explorer.
Tanner Jacobi
Coldlander, a novel, available in paperback and as an ebook.

muzik
Posts: 3910
Joined: January 28th, 2016, 2:47 pm
Location: Scotland

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

Kazyan wrote:Add apgsearch.py to Golly's Scripts folder, then double-click the file from within Golly, instead of your file explorer.
When I do this, and click on it, it just gives a dialog box "Could not load the Python library" and asks me to type in the file adress for python27.dll and even when I do, the same box just comes up again.

Tried both with python27.dll at the end and not.

Where exactly should the file be located? When I searched for it, I found it in system32, but I'm not sure if that's the correct file. Is there a way to generate one?
Bored of using the Moore neighbourhood for everything? Introducing the Range-2 von Neumann isotropic non-totalistic rulespace!

muzik
Posts: 3910
Joined: January 28th, 2016, 2:47 pm
Location: Scotland

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

Just to say: I do indeed have both Python and Golly installed, and Python works pretty normally as I remember it. Golly also works pretty much perfectly (I have more experience with the mobile version and as such use it more) so there shouldn't really be this problem.
Bored of using the Moore neighbourhood for everything? Introducing the Range-2 von Neumann isotropic non-totalistic rulespace!

calcyman
Posts: 2270
Joined: June 1st, 2009, 4:32 pm

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

The most common problem when trying to run Python scripts in Golly occurs when the user has installed different bittages of Python and Golly. Can you ensure they're either both 64-bit or both 32-bit?
What do you do with ill crystallographers? Take them to the mono-clinic!

drc
Posts: 1664
Joined: December 3rd, 2015, 4:11 pm
Location: creating useless things in OCA

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

Did you update catagolue, because I just suddenly discovered about 15 objects today:

http://catagolue.appspot.com/user/Danie ... iscoveries
\100\97\110\105

calcyman
Posts: 2270
Joined: June 1st, 2009, 4:32 pm

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

drc wrote:Did you update catagolue, because I just suddenly discovered about 15 objects today:

http://catagolue.appspot.com/user/Danie ... iscoveries
Yes, I want to be able to make Catagolue delete old b3s23/C1 hauls, but retain the ones that contain the first few instances of interesting objects. As a minor side-effect, all of the 'discoveries' sections have expanded.
What do you do with ill crystallographers? Take them to the mono-clinic!

muzik
Posts: 3910
Joined: January 28th, 2016, 2:47 pm
Location: Scotland

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

calcyman wrote:The most common problem when trying to run Python scripts in Golly occurs when the user has installed different bittages of Python and Golly. Can you ensure they're either both 64-bit or both 32-bit?
OH now I see. looks like I'm running 32 bit golly.

Where can I get the 64 bit version?

EDIT: Found it, let's see how this goes

EDIT2: YUY! It works! Just uploaded my pathetically small first haul for regular life. Now to test out some more rules.

EDIT3: Currently peppering B3/S12 with small hauls. Seems to be working fairly well. But how do you search non-Life like rules such as B2in3/S123a?
Bored of using the Moore neighbourhood for everything? Introducing the Range-2 von Neumann isotropic non-totalistic rulespace!

drc
Posts: 1664
Joined: December 3rd, 2015, 4:11 pm
Location: creating useless things in OCA

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

muzik wrote:But how do you search non-Life like rules such as B2in3/S123a?

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=1480&start=50
\100\97\110\105

Kazyan
Posts: 1001
Joined: February 6th, 2014, 11:02 pm

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

calcyman wrote:The most common problem when trying to run Python scripts in Golly occurs when the user has installed different bittages of Python and Golly. Can you ensure they're either both 64-bit or both 32-bit?
Ah, now, this is a much more helpful answer than what I was going to say, which was 'get a sorcerer to fix it and then never touch it again', as per my own experiences in making Python play nice with Golly.
Tanner Jacobi
Coldlander, a novel, available in paperback and as an ebook.

Scorbie
Posts: 1464
Joined: December 7th, 2013, 1:05 am

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

Kazyan wrote:I was going to say, which was 'get a sorcerer to fix it and then never touch it again', as per my own experiences in making Python play nice with Golly.
LOL. Who was the sorceror? Or am I getting it wrong?
Best wishes to you, Scorbie

Apple Bottom
Posts: 1034
Joined: July 27th, 2015, 2:06 pm
Contact:

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

calcyman wrote:Yes, I want to be able to make Catagolue delete old b3s23/C1 hauls, but retain the ones that contain the first few instances of interesting objects. As a minor side-effect, all of the 'discoveries' sections have expanded.
Clicking on your slice on the b3s23/C1 pie chart now raises an internal server error -- I've got a hunch that this is no coincidence, and that the site's is instead exceeding its maximum per-request execution time.
If you speak, your speech must be better than your silence would have been. — Arabian proverb

Catagolue: Apple Bottom • Life Wiki: Apple Bottom • Twitter: @_AppleBottom_

Proud member of the Pattern Raiders!

muzik
Posts: 3910
Joined: January 28th, 2016, 2:47 pm
Location: Scotland

### Re: apgsearch v1.0

Looks like my apgsearch glitched out and submitted a mutant Siamese twin haul:

I mean, not that that's a major problem or anything, just kinda interesting
Bored of using the Moore neighbourhood for everything? Introducing the Range-2 von Neumann isotropic non-totalistic rulespace!