What about a t! growth?hotdogPi wrote: ↑March 8th, 2023, 1:03 pmhttps://conwaylife.com/wiki/Tlog(t)_growth
They're equivalent.
Thread for basic questions
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Re: Thread for basic questions
Re: Thread for basic questions
Isn't that faster than quadratic though?AlbertArmStain wrote: ↑March 9th, 2023, 6:27 pmWhat about a t! growth?hotdogPi wrote: ↑March 8th, 2023, 1:03 pmhttps://conwaylife.com/wiki/Tlog(t)_growth
They're equivalent.
How about sqrt(t)! or log(t)! growth?
Code: Select all
x=17,y=16,rule=B3/S23
3bo3bobo2bob2o$bobo4bo4b4o$bobo5bobo2b3o$b2obob2o3b2o$3o4b2ob2o2b2o$4b
o4bo$4b2obobob2ob3o$3ob3o2b2o$b3o2bobobo5bo$o3b2o3bobo2b2o$4bo3bob2o3b
o$2obo2bobobo2b2o$3b3o5bo2b2o$2obo4bo2bob2o$o3bob2obo3b2o$2bo8bobobo![[ STOP 3 GPS 4 ]]
Re: Thread for basic questions
hotdogPi wrote: ↑March 8th, 2023, 1:03 pmhttps://conwaylife.com/wiki/Tlog(t)_growth
They're equivalent.
t! is O(sqrt(t)*(t/e)^t), which is exponential, so not be possible in a CA of any finite number of dimensions
sqrt(t)! is also exponential.
log(t)! is O(t*(log t)^1.5), so it is theoretically possible in a 2D CA like Life.
- confocaloid
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Re: Thread for basic questions
What is the repeat time of the "functionally stable" p8 glider reflector?
Code: Select all
x = 156, y = 148, rule = B3/S23
154bo$153bo$153b3o38$115bo$113b2o$114b2o33$95b2o$95bo$81bobo9bobo$82b
2o9b2o$82bo3$92b2o$92b2o3b2o$96bo2bo2$95bo$82b2o11bo2bo$82bo5b2o3b2ob
2o$83b3o2b2o3b3o$85bo8bo$83b2o$83bo$84bo8b2o$83b2o8b2o9$46b2o$47b2o$
41bo4bo$41b2o$40bobo36$6b3o$8bo$b2o4bo$obo$2bo!
#C [[ ZOOM 6 THEME LifeHistory ]]
127:1 B3/S234c User:Confocal/R (isotropic rules, incomplete)
Unlikely events happen.
My silence does not imply agreement, nor indifference. If I disagreed with something in the past, then please do not construe my silence as something that could change that.
Unlikely events happen.
My silence does not imply agreement, nor indifference. If I disagreed with something in the past, then please do not construe my silence as something that could change that.
- squareroot12621
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Re: Thread for basic questions
43, excluding output gliders.
Code: Select all
x = 30, y = 29, rule = B3/S23
2bo$obo$b2o7$25b2o$25bo$11bobo9bobo$12b2o9b2o$12bo3$22b2o$22b2o3b2o$26b
o2bo2$25bo$12b2o11bo2bo$12bo5b2o3b2ob2o$13b3o2b2o3b3o$15bo8bo$13b2o$13b
o$14bo8b2o$13b2o8b2o!
[[ PASTEMODE 3 PASTET 50 PASTE 3b$3b$3b! 18 12 ]]
Code: Select all
4b8o$4b8o$4b8o$4b8o$4o8b4o$4o8b4o$4o8b4o$4o8b4o$4o8b4o$4o8b4o$4o8b4o$4o8b4o$4b8o$4b8o$4b8o$4b8o![[ THEME 0 AUTOSTART GPS 8 Z 16 T 1 T 1 Z 19.027 T 2 T 2 Z 22.627 T 3 T 3 Z 26.909 T 4 T 4 Z 32 T 5 T 5 Z 38.055 T 6 T 6 Z 45.255 T 7 T 7 Z 53.817 LOOP 8 ]]
Re: Thread for basic questions
The output gliders are kind of the point, though... and surprisingly, if they're included, the answer still isn't necessarily all that bad.
It looks like the repeat time will generally be limited by the repeat time of the glider inserter being used. With an NW31 you can go as low as 70 ticks, which seems pretty good:
Code: Select all
x = 44, y = 31, rule = B3/S23
15b2o$15b2o2$40b2o$40bo$38bobo$16bob2o6b2o10b2o$15b2o2bo5bo3bo$13bo5bo
4bo5bo$15b3o7bo4bo$2o9bo3b2o10bo2bo6b2o$2o9bobo13bobo7b2o3b2o$15bo12bo
13b2o$15bo$15bo3b2o21bo$27b2o12b2o$27bo5b2o4b2o2bo$28b3o2b2o4bobo$30bo
8bo$28b2o$10b3o15bo$11bo8b2o7bo8b2o$11b3o6bo7b2o8b2o$21b3o$23bo3$5b2o$
4bobo$4bo$3b2o!
Re: Thread for basic questions
is there a weld that can allow the 2 p10 domino sparkers in this p190 partial to both work, and thus complete it?
Code: Select all
x = 36, y = 54, rule = B3/S23
30b2o$29bobo$27b3o$27b2ob4o$28bobo3bo$29bo2bo2bo$29b6o2$26b2o2b3o$26b
2ob2ob3o$16b2o9b2obo4bo$bo2bo11b2o9b2o2b5o$ob2obo16bo4b2obo$bo2bo16bo
bo3b3ob2ob2o$bo2bo18bo4bo3bobo$ob2obo17bo5b2obobo$bo2bo14bo3bo6bobob2o
$19bo3bo6bobo$23bo5b2obo$23bo4bo3bob2o$21bobo3b6ob2o$22bo4b5o$3bo8bo14b
3ob5o$2bobo7bo14b2ob4obo$2b2o7bo14b5ob3o$26b2ob4o2bo$29b6o$13b3o13b6o
$13b3o10b2ob4o2bo$2b2o8bobo11b5ob3o$2bobo7b2o13b2ob4obo$3bo23b3ob5o$27b
5o$22b3o2b6ob2o$24bo3bo3bob2o$23bobo3b2obo$23b2o5bobo$bo2bo18b2o5bobo
b2o$ob2obo17bobo3b2obobo$bo2bo19bo3bo3bobo$bo2bo17b3o2b3ob2ob2o$ob2ob
o21b2obo$bo2bo11b2o9b2o2b5o$16b2o9b2obo4bo$26b2ob2ob3o$26b2o2b3o2$29b
6o$29bo2bo2bo$28bobo3bo$27b2ob4o$27b3o$29bobo$30b2o!
- Christopher D'Agostino
adopted father of the U-turner
the U-turner gallery
255P132
B3/S234z (Zlife)
adopted father of the U-turner
Code: Select all
x = 11, y = 15, rule = B3/S23
9bo$8bobo$8bobo$9bo8$b3o$b3o$obo$2o!
255P132
B3/S234z (Zlife)
Re: Thread for basic questions
Why can a Klein bottle only have a shift of one?
Help wanted: How can we accurately notate any 1D replicator?
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Re: Thread for basic questions
Should we add this to the wiki for chucklebait?
- confocaloid
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Re: Thread for basic questions
A "what if" question: What could be the consequences, if at design stage Catagolue apgcodes were designed in such a way that period-2 oscillators would have multiple tabulations according to the minimum population, similarly to the still lifes?
For instance, prefixes "xd3_", "xd6_", "xd14_" could be used for p2 oscillators with minpop 3, 6, 14 respectively (instead of just one prefix/tabulation "xp2_").
(A motivation for the question is that p2 ash is common, and p2 intermediate targets are common in slow salvos. Higher-period oscillators are much less common in B3/S23, so for this question one may assume that higher prefixes "xp3_", "xp4_", ... remain as they are.)
For instance, prefixes "xd3_", "xd6_", "xd14_" could be used for p2 oscillators with minpop 3, 6, 14 respectively (instead of just one prefix/tabulation "xp2_").
(A motivation for the question is that p2 ash is common, and p2 intermediate targets are common in slow salvos. Higher-period oscillators are much less common in B3/S23, so for this question one may assume that higher prefixes "xp3_", "xp4_", ... remain as they are.)
127:1 B3/S234c User:Confocal/R (isotropic rules, incomplete)
Unlikely events happen.
My silence does not imply agreement, nor indifference. If I disagreed with something in the past, then please do not construe my silence as something that could change that.
Unlikely events happen.
My silence does not imply agreement, nor indifference. If I disagreed with something in the past, then please do not construe my silence as something that could change that.
Re: Thread for basic questions
Why not just do this in general? E.g. oscillators as xp2_3_..., spaceships as xq4_5_... etc. It would make it much easier to search through results for oscillators and spaceships of a particular size, within their given period and/or velocity.confocaloid wrote: ↑March 20th, 2023, 3:28 pmA "what if" question: What could be the consequences, if at design stage Catagolue apgcodes were designed in such a way that period-2 oscillators would have multiple tabulations according to the minimum population, similarly to the still lifes?
For instance, prefixes "xd3_", "xd6_", "xd14_" could be used for p2 oscillators with minpop 3, 6, 14 respectively (instead of just one prefix/tabulation "xp2_").
(A motivation for the question is that p2 ash is common, and p2 intermediate targets are common in slow salvos. Higher-period oscillators are much less common in B3/S23, so for this question one may assume that higher prefixes "xp3_", "xp4_", ... remain as they are.)
- toroidalet
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Re: Thread for basic questions
Consider the following 4*4 pattern on a Klein bottle (Klein bottles don't work in LifeViewer, so run these patterns in Golly):
Code: Select all
x = 4, y = 4, rule = LifeHistory:K4*,4
4D$B.A$B3A$B2.A!
Code: Select all
x = 32, y = 32, rule = LifeHistory
32D$B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A$B3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3A$B2.AB2.A
B2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.A$32D$.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B$3AB3AB
3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB$A2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.B$32D$B.A.B.A.B.A.B
.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A$B3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3A$B2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB
2.AB2.A$32D$.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B$3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB
$A2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.B$32D$B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A
$B3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3A$B2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.A$32D$.A.B.A
.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B$3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB$A2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA
2.BA2.BA2.BA2.B$32D$B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A$B3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB
3AB3AB3A$B2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.A$32D$.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.
B.A.B.A.B$3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB$A2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.B!
Code: Select all
x = 33, y = 32, rule = LifeHistory
.32D$.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A$.B3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3A$.B2.A
B2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.A$32D$.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B$3AB
3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB$A2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.B$.32D$.B.A.B.A.
B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A$.B3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3A$.B2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB
2.AB2.AB2.AB2.A$32D$.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B$3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB
3AB3AB3AB$A2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.B$.32D$.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.
B.A.B.A.B.A$.B3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3A$.B2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB
2.A$32D$.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B$3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB$A2.
BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.B$.32D$.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A$.
B3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3A$.B2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.A$32D$.A.B.A
.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B$3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB$A2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA
2.BA2.BA2.BA2.B!
Code: Select all
x = 4, y = 4, rule = LifeHistory:K4*+1,4
4D$B.A$B3A$B2.A!
And if we shift it by 2, we get this grid:
Code: Select all
x = 34, y = 32, rule = LifeHistory
2.32D$2.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A$2.B3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3A$2.
B2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.A$32D$.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B
$3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB$A2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.B$2.32D$2.B.
A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A$2.B3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3A$2.B2.AB2.AB
2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.A$32D$.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B$3AB3AB3A
B3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB$A2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.B$2.32D$2.B.A.B.A.B.A
.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A$2.B3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3A$2.B2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.
AB2.AB2.AB2.A$32D$.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B$3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB
3AB3AB$A2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.B$2.32D$2.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B
.A.B.A.B.A$2.B3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3A$2.B2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB
2.A$32D$.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B$3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB3AB$A2.
BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.B!
Code: Select all
x = 34, y = 32, rule = LifeHistory
2.32D$3.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA$3.C2A.C2A.C2A.C2A.C2A.C2A.C2A.
C2A$3.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A$32D$.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB
2.AB$2AC.2AC.2AC.2AC.2AC.2AC.2AC.2AC$A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B$
2.32D$3.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA$3.C2A.C2A.C2A.C2A.C2A.C2A.C2A.
C2A$3.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A$32D$.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB
2.AB$2AC.2AC.2AC.2AC.2AC.2AC.2AC.2AC$A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B$
2.32D$3.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA$3.C2A.C2A.C2A.C2A.C2A.C2A.C2A.
C2A$3.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A$32D$.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB
2.AB$2AC.2AC.2AC.2AC.2AC.2AC.2AC.2AC$A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B$
2.32D$3.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA2.BA$3.C2A.C2A.C2A.C2A.C2A.C2A.C2A.
C2A$3.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A$32D$.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB2.AB
2.AB$2AC.2AC.2AC.2AC.2AC.2AC.2AC.2AC$A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B.A.B!
Code: Select all
x = 4, y = 4, rule = LifeHistory:K4*,4
4D$BA$C2A$B.A!
As for why you can't have a shift on the untwisted edge, that's a little simpler. Adding a shift requires the two edges to be distinguished, so that there is a distinct "left" and "right" edge. If you cross the right edge you move down, and if you cross the left you move up.
But there is really only one untwisted edge (a bit like a Möbius strip). If you stood next to the right edge, put your hand on it and crossed the bottom edge, you would end up with that same hand on the left edge.
As a result, because there is only one edge, they both have to do the same thing when you cross them, and they both can't shift you in the same direction. You can't make it into a grid:
Code: Select all
x = 16, y = 17, rule = LifeHistory
4D$B.A.4D$B3AB.A.4D$B2.AB3AB.A.4D$4.B2.AB3AB.A$8.B2.AB3A$12.B2.A$5.B$
4.3B$5.B$12.4D$8.4D.A.B$4.4D.A.B3AB$4D.A.B3ABA2.B$.A.B3ABA2.B$3ABA2.B
$A2.B!
Code: Select all
x = 16, y = 19, rule = LifeHistory
4D$B.A.4D$B3AB.A.4D$B2.AB3AB.A.4D$4DB2.AB3AB.A$.A.B4DB2.AB3A$3AB.A.B
4DB2.A$A2.B3AB.A.B4D$4DA2.B3AB.A.B$B.A.4DA2.B3AB$B3AB.A.4DA2.B$B2.AB
3AB.A.4D$4DB2.AB3AB.A$.A.B4DB2.AB3A$3AB.A.B4DB2.A$A2.B3AB.A.B4D$4.A2.
B3AB.A.B$8.A2.B3AB$12.A2.B!
The first case is a problem because you are now heading to the left, so you must have been turned around while staying on the same row, which is obviously very bad. The second case is a little subtler. Consider this diagram:
Code: Select all
x = 50, y = 10, rule = LifeHistory
10D10.10D10.9DE$B19.B19.B$B19.B19.B$B11.B7.B11.B7.B$BC11.B6.C12.B6.B$
BE8.5B5.E9.5B5.B$B12.B6.B12.B6.B$B11.B7.B11.B7.B$B19.B19.B$B19.B19.B
8.C!
By the way, just as an aside, Klein bottles and asymmetric rules are a stupid combination. In these rules, patterns cross the edge and then behave differently, which defeats the whole purpose of a Klein bottle.
Of course, people may still want to keep them for the same reasons as B0 rule tables.
Any sufficiently advanced software is indistinguishable from malice.
- confocaloid
- Posts: 2729
- Joined: February 8th, 2022, 3:15 pm
Re: Thread for basic questions
Yes, a general two-way split (by period and by minimum population) would probably be more convenient from the user's viewpoint. Although apgcodes would become slightly longer. While "xp15_4r4z4r4" is shorter than "pentadecathlon", "xp15_12_4r4z4r4" would be longer than "pentadecathlon".mniemiec wrote: ↑March 20th, 2023, 7:44 pmWhy not just do this in general? E.g. oscillators as xp2_3_..., spaceships as xq4_5_... etc. It would make it much easier to search through results for oscillators and spaceships of a particular size, within their given period and/or velocity.confocaloid wrote: ↑March 20th, 2023, 3:28 pmA "what if" question: What could be the consequences, if at design stage Catagolue apgcodes were designed in such a way that period-2 oscillators would have multiple tabulations according to the minimum population, similarly to the still lifes?
To make things easier to understand / preserve partial compatibility with other formats, maybe one could introduce a combination of the Pentadecathlon ID and the apgcodes. This would also reflect the displacement for spaceships (so that c/6o, 2c/6o and (2,1)c/6 would be three different tabulations).
For example, "12P15_4r4z4r4" could refer to the pentadecathlon (which is again shorter than "pentadecathlon").
Similarly, "34P3H1V0_mhqkzarahh0heezdhb5" would then refer to the dart, etc. -- the prefix is the Pentadecathlon ID (without the part after the dot) and the suffix is the apgcode suffix.
(In my "what if" question above, I asked about the p2 case specifically, because it seems like there are very many p2 oscillators and p2 constellations that are catalogued in Catagolue/Shinjuku/somewhere else using their apgcodes, which dumps them all in the same tabulation. While the general two-way split seems to require substantial changes to the apgcode format, one can imagine a limited solution for the p1/p2 special case, that mostly keeps things as they are, and just introduces one other prefix (e.g. "xd", by interpreting "d" as "double" and re-interpreting "s" in "xs" as "single"). I do not know what could be consequences.)
127:1 B3/S234c User:Confocal/R (isotropic rules, incomplete)
Unlikely events happen.
My silence does not imply agreement, nor indifference. If I disagreed with something in the past, then please do not construe my silence as something that could change that.
Unlikely events happen.
My silence does not imply agreement, nor indifference. If I disagreed with something in the past, then please do not construe my silence as something that could change that.
Re: Thread for basic questions
Catagolue doesn't seem to be too concerned about minimum size. Soups are stored as a character matrix, rather than being encoded as an RLE, even though converting to/from RLE is extremely easy. This adds a much larger increase in space for each soup than a 2-3-character increase to each oscillator and spaceship, even though those are usually vastly outnumbered by still-lifes (which won't change). Even worse, if a pattern occurs in 100 soups, the extra space consumed by the soup is replicated a hundred-fold.confocaloid wrote: ↑March 21st, 2023, 1:30 pmYes, a general two-way split (by period and by minimum population) would probably be more convenient from the user's viewpoint. Although apgcodes would become slightly longer. While "xp15_4r4z4r4" is shorter than "pentadecathlon", "xp15_12_4r4z4r4" would be longer than "pentadecathlon".
- Drelectron8
- Posts: 34
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- Location: Queenstown, Singapore
- Contact:
Re: Thread for basic questions
What is the fastest way to find a spaceship in any Cellular Automata? Do you need a script or just naturally find it in soups?
Code: Select all
x = 20, y = 28, rule = B01356/S012345
17b3o$5b6o$4b5ob10o$3b15o$4b4ob9o$5b5o6$17b3o$4b6o$3b5ob11o$2b16o$3b4o
b10o$4b5o6$17b3o$2b7o$b6ob12o$18o$b5ob11o$2b6o!
~Drelectron8
Re: Thread for basic questions
"Fastest" is difficult to give a definite answer for across such an impossibly wide range as "any Cellular Automaton".Drelectron8 wrote: ↑March 22nd, 2023, 7:11 amWhat is the fastest way to find a spaceship in any Cellular Automata? Do you need a script or just naturally find it in soups?
There's an easy recommendation for "simplest option if it works": use apgsearch to run a soup-search haul of the rule that you're interested in. If an "xq" object shows up, then you've found a natural spaceship.
However, there are lots and lots of explosive CA rules that apgsearch can't census effectively, and other CA rules that basically never produce natural spaceships from soup, and still other CA rules that apgsearch simply doesn't support ... that nonetheless support an endless variety of spaceships.
To find spaceships outside of apgsearch's "home range", you're better off with a search program like LLS (Logic Life Search), gfind, etc. -- see this Search Software LifeWiki page for a description of options.
Re: Thread for basic questions
They're not stored as character matrices; they're stored as hash preimages. They're only converted to ASCII patterns in the frontend to make it convenient for copying into simulation software such as Golly. Also, the list of soups in which a pattern has occurred is gzip-compressed at rest to minimise unnecessary storage overhead.mniemiec wrote: ↑March 21st, 2023, 3:57 pmCatagolue doesn't seem to be too concerned about minimum size. Soups are stored as a character matrix, rather than being encoded as an RLE, even though converting to/from RLE is extremely easy. This adds a much larger increase in space for each soup than a 2-3-character increase to each oscillator and spaceship, even though those are usually vastly outnumbered by still-lifes (which won't change). Even worse, if a pattern occurs in 100 soups, the extra space consumed by the soup is replicated a hundred-fold.
What do you do with ill crystallographers? Take them to the mono-clinic!
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Re: Thread for basic questions
Is it possible to build a caber tosser (or sawtooth) in discrete cellular automata such that
1) its expansion factor is not an integer, and
2) the generations at which the pattern emits an output (or reaches a fixed minimum population) can be serially calculated with a closed-form expression that
a. is non-recursive,
b. is not piecewise, and
c. involves no rounding operations (floor/ceiling/nearest)
?
If not, what conditon in 2) should be relaxed if the non-integer e.f. requirement in 1) is insisted?
1) its expansion factor is not an integer, and
2) the generations at which the pattern emits an output (or reaches a fixed minimum population) can be serially calculated with a closed-form expression that
a. is non-recursive,
b. is not piecewise, and
c. involves no rounding operations (floor/ceiling/nearest)
?
If not, what conditon in 2) should be relaxed if the non-integer e.f. requirement in 1) is insisted?
熠熠种花 - Glimmering Garden
Harvest Moon
2-engine p45 gliderless HWSS gun
Small p2070 glider gun
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Harvest Moon
2-engine p45 gliderless HWSS gun
Small p2070 glider gun
Forgive me if I withhold my enthusiasm.
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Re: Thread for basic questions
Does logarithmic_width.mc count? It's a sawtooth in the Wiki definition (which includes replicators), and it is governed by the formula:GUYTU6J wrote: ↑March 23rd, 2023, 1:36 pmIs it possible to build a caber tosser (or sawtooth) in discrete cellular automata such that
1) its expansion factor is not an integer, and
2) the generations at which the pattern emits an output (or reaches a fixed minimum population) can be serially calculated with a closed-form expression that
a. is non-recursive,
b. is not piecewise, and
c. involves no rounding operations (floor/ceiling/nearest)
?
If not, what conditon in 2) should be relaxed if the non-integer e.f. requirement in 1) is insisted?
(from oeis.org)a(n) = v1*w1^n+v3*w2^n+v2*w3^n, where v1,2,3 are the roots of (-1+9*x-31*x^2+31*x^3): [v1=0.6114919920, v2=0.1942540040 - 0.1225496913*I, v3=conjugate(v2)] and w1,2,3 are the roots of (-1-x^2+x^3): [w1=1.4655712319, w2=-0.2327856159 - 0.7925519925*I, w3=conjugate(w2)]. - Gerry Martens, Jun 27 2015
It then reaches a minimum population of 4,496 in generation 240*a(3n)-815, starting from n=2.
If you want an actual caber tossing pattern, I think it should be possible to construct one using the irrational glider stream. For example, we could have one copy bouncing off boats from a boat puffer (if you're a little fancier, you could make one with irrational-density push reactions instead), where the caber-tossed glider is reflected off of these sideways gliders. Those that don't instead crash into another copy of the glider stream which is eating up another line of blocks or something. The blue gliders are delayed from the green gliders so that they perfectly match up with the red gliders.
Any sufficiently advanced software is indistinguishable from malice.
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Re: Thread for basic questions
is it possible to hack ntzfind to search in OT, INT, and maybe even B0 rules?
an alternate account for get_Snacked in case he loses his password and can't recover. hence, a much weaker password.
Re: Thread for basic questions
ntzfind supports all life-like rules (and hence outer totalistic) as far as I know. and the name, ntzfind is short for non-totalistic zfind (so of course it supports INT rules) but I don't think it works with B0 rules. but could probably be adjusted to do soget_snackeTWO wrote: ↑March 24th, 2023, 1:46 pmis it possible to hack ntzfind to search in OT, INT, and maybe even B0 rules?
Code: Select all
x=17,y=16,rule=B3/S23
3bo3bobo2bob2o$bobo4bo4b4o$bobo5bobo2b3o$b2obob2o3b2o$3o4b2ob2o2b2o$4b
o4bo$4b2obobob2ob3o$3ob3o2b2o$b3o2bobobo5bo$o3b2o3bobo2b2o$4bo3bob2o3b
o$2obo2bobobo2b2o$3b3o5bo2b2o$2obo4bo2bob2o$o3bob2obo3b2o$2bo8bobobo![[ STOP 3 GPS 4 ]]
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Re: Thread for basic questions
oh. when i looked at the final ntzfind script i saw the rule set as "B3/S23" so i thought it was only for Life.pipsqueek wrote: ↑March 25th, 2023, 12:14 pmntzfind supports all life-like rules (and hence outer totalistic) as far as I know. and the name, ntzfind is short for non-totalistic zfind (so of course it supports INT rules) but I don't think it works with B0 rules. but could probably be adjusted to do so
1983263225470666662666647618
Re: Thread for basic questions
what is the largest known naturally occurring non-extensible spaceship in any INT rule?
Code: Select all
x=17,y=16,rule=B3/S23
3bo3bobo2bob2o$bobo4bo4b4o$bobo5bobo2b3o$b2obob2o3b2o$3o4b2ob2o2b2o$4b
o4bo$4b2obobob2ob3o$3ob3o2b2o$b3o2bobobo5bo$o3b2o3bobo2b2o$4bo3bob2o3b
o$2obo2bobobo2b2o$3b3o5bo2b2o$2obo4bo2bob2o$o3bob2obo3b2o$2bo8bobobo![[ STOP 3 GPS 4 ]]
Re: Thread for basic questions
Does "largest" mean largest by bounding box or by population? Does "naturally occurring" mean it's on Catagolue? Would spaceships from symmetric soups count?
I was thinking maybe some random ship from ZombieLife might qualify, but then it seemed more likely that something out of the whitespace rulespace would probably come out ahead:
Code: Select all
x = 23, y = 23, rule = B34ejkw5ci6ci7c/S2cn3-jk4aer5i6-ak78
3o$3o$3o19$21b2o$21b2o!
Anyone have a definite candidate for largest known natural INT spaceship?
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Re: Thread for basic questions
Code: Select all
x = 117, y = 50, rule = B3/S23
29bob2o27bo48bob2o$29b2obo76b2obo$60bo$27b5o75b5o$27bo4bo2b2o23bo46bo
4bo2b2o$30bo2bo2bo73bo2bo2bo$30b2obobo24bo49b2obobo$27bo5bob2o70bo5bob
2o$26bobo4bo26bo45bobo4bo$26bo2bo2b2o72bo2bo2b2o$27b2o31bo46b2o2$60bo
2$60bo2$60bo2$60bo$19b2o78b2o$19b2o39bo38b2o2$60bo2$60bo2$60bo2$5b2o
22b2o29bo24b2o22b2o$4bo2bo21bo54bo2bo21bo$5b2o23b3o27bo24b2o23b3o$32bo
79bo$60bo2$60bo2$60bo$22b2o78b2o$22bo37bo41bo$23b3o77b3o$b2o22bo34bo
44bo$obo$2bo57bo2$60bo2$60bo$83bobo$60bo22b2o$84bo!
(The pattern is the rectifier, a 180-degree reflector with the output glider on a transparent lane.)
The pattern below is an unmodified copy of the generation T = 200.
Questions:
- (Q1) Is it possible to rewind the pattern shown below for 20 ticks?
- (Q2) Is it possible to rewind the pattern shown below for 200 ticks?
- (Q3) Is the pattern shown below rewindable to infinity?
Code: Select all
x = 34, y = 50, rule = B3/S23
26bob2o$26b2obo2$24b5o$24bo4bo2b2o$27bo2bo2bo$27b2obobo$24bo5bob2o$23b
obo4bo$23bo2bo2b2o$24b2o9$16b2o$16b2o8$2b2o22b2o$bo2bo21bo$2b2o23b3o$
29bo6$19b2o$19bo$20b3o$22bo7$obo$2o$bo!
127:1 B3/S234c User:Confocal/R (isotropic rules, incomplete)
Unlikely events happen.
My silence does not imply agreement, nor indifference. If I disagreed with something in the past, then please do not construe my silence as something that could change that.
Unlikely events happen.
My silence does not imply agreement, nor indifference. If I disagreed with something in the past, then please do not construe my silence as something that could change that.